Former Governor Mario Cuomo often said that you campaign in poetry, but govern in prose. Another take on the task comes from the management profession: "If you can't measure it, you can't manage it. This is hard work, and to most who have little experience in doing it, it's scary. But there are plenty of people around who have intelligence, energy and even experience.
So herewith we offer a governance outline from the infamous Gadfly community. It needs some filling-in and fine tuning and criticism. And then it needs some additional quantification and a time-line so it can be measured and managed. The campaign promise list needs some "how and when" tweaking.
Mission:
Provide essential services
in the most cost-effective manner possible.
Achieve fiscal
responsibility by reducing the cost of government, reducing the inter-fund
debt, lowering taxes and restoring the town’s municipal credit rating.
Attract and retain
businesses by making East Greenbush a good
place to do business.
Maintain and upgrade the
town’s infrastructure.
Operating Principles for
Town Officials:
·
Be fiscally responsible and accountable.
· Always
act in the best interests of the community.
· Commit
to a policy of transparency and maximum sharing of public information.
Financial Recovery:
Reduce the size of the town
workforce by attrition rather than layoffs.
Implement a hiring freeze for all but essential positions. Convert positions from full time to part time
or seasonal employment whenever feasible.
Place limits on the use of
consultants. Implement a rule that
consultants who recommend a project may not receive contracts from those
projects.
Reduce the cost of local
government by 10% within three years.
Require all managers to submit a plan to reduce their department budgets
by 10% in the next fiscal year. Any
manager who refuses to submit a plan with at least 10% in reductions will have
their budget automatically reduced by 10% at the discretion of the supervisor
and town board.
Reduce town taxes by 15%
within three years.
Consolidate town services
with either the county or other municipalities whenever possible.
Explore municipal town
consolidations in the capital district. Seek and obtain support from the
governor’s initiative on this project and goal.
Town Operations:
Commit to the application of
generally accepted accounting principles in all aspects of town
operations. Purchase and install
accounting software.
Conduct a workload analysis
for all town departments, including the Department of Public Works and the
Police Department.
Develop and implement
measurable goals for each town department and department head. Utilize annual
performance reviews to assess, recognize and reward goal attainment by each
department head.
Make all appointments based
on merit. Create and implement a best practices method for posting open
position and interviewing and selecting candidates. Recognize and support
diversity in hiring.
Conduct full and meaningful
external audits every year. Specify
individual operations for forensic audit on a rotating basis. Publish the results in a timely manner.
Prepare a ten to fifteen
year schedule for the maintenance, repair and replacement of town vehicles.
Community Relations:
Commit to a return of the
question and answer session at town board meetings or schedule another meeting
on a monthly basis to address residents’ concerns.
Utilize the town website to
increase the sharing of public information.
Make the supervisor’s report substantive and not political.
Fully utilize town
committees like the Board of Ethics and the Citizens Financial Advisory
Committee to advise the Town Board and Supervisor on important decisions.
Investigate the best ideas
for revitalizing Columbia Turnpike.
Measure the impact on town
services of businesses on the Rt. 4 corridor.
Goals for Governing from
the Smart Way
Forward letters to the Advertiser during the last campaign:
1) Zero-based
budgeting rather than incremental budgeting.
2) Establish
procedures for accurate revenue projections.
3) No borrowing from
other funds to cover general fund shortfalls.
4) Re-consider the
Ethics Law in January.
5) Apply for aid
from the State’s new Financial Restructuring Board.
6) A zero tax
increase for 2014.
7) Coherent master
plan for 9 & 20.
I may have left some issues
out or not sufficiently explained amplified these items, so the majority is
invited to jump in and amplify.
Dear Gadfly,
ReplyDeleteThank you for making such a comprehensive and highly informative post.
As a regular voter and Town Taxpayer, I'm looking forward to reading about Supervisor Langley's goals and objectives for East Greenbush. Perhaps Supervisor Langley might outline his goals and objectives in a State of the Town Address, similar to the one recently presented by Colonie Town Supervisor Paula Mahan.
What exactly is gadfly anyway?
ReplyDeleteA gadfly is someone who does not care one bit about which political party has the majority and which has a minority.
A gadfly is someone who cares only about good governance.
A gadfly is someone who is not looking for a town job for themselves, their family members or their friends. Gadflies don't want stipends, contracts, consulting deals or any other financial things from our town.
A gadfly is someone who cares - and about only one thing - what is best for the town and its taxpayers.
Gadflies want facts; not political spin, lies, miss direction or nonsense.
A gadfly is someone who makes political enemies from both political parties.
A gadfly is someone who reads about town issues, writes about town issues and speaks out about town issues.
A gadfly is someone who questions things that do not make any sense. A gadfly does not blindly follow any politician or political party.
Gadflies have energed from efforts to reform how East Greenbush is managed, Gadflies have emerged as a force to be respected. Instead politicans from both political parties hate, absolutely and positively despise gadflies.
Mr. Langley, Mr. Defruscio, Mr. Gilbert, Ms. Matters, Ms. DiMartino: What is so hard about answering simple, basic questions with open, honest answers? By the way, none of you are gods so get over yourselves.
Here's a simple example from the 2014 Organizational Meeting:
How many town jobs did you add?
How much is that costing taxpayers?
How many jobs did you eliminate?
How much is that savings taxpayers?
Gadflies, by the way, are not going away. Not now, not ever. Thanks to Phil Malone for the original gadfly label. And as a tribute to my friend and former neighbor Jack Conway, congratulations, some nice person over on one of the other blogs has branded you a gadfly. Welcome to the group.
Ray Mooney
One point that is missing and, unfortunately is lost on some "R's" is to spend your time focusing on your job as Councilperson or Supervisor and STOP wasting precious time scurrying throughout the Town asking what people are discussing and why certain individuals are conversing with other individuals. DO YOUR JOBS and DO WHAT YOU PROMISED. Stop dictating and stop being so nosy about our personal lives. Stop calling our friends to inquire on what we are conversing with others about. Buckle down and begin working on our Town's fiscal issues. If you spend half the time tackling the Town's issues that you do feeding your paranoia you may see some success. Labor contracts are due, the deficit looms, bond status should be improved, there are a litany of issues for you to grapple with--focus on those and stop focusing on who and what we discuss with one another.
ReplyDeleteNice try Gadfly. If you really want this information you should FOIL it. But, I'm pretty sure the information you want is NOT covered by FOIL. You should read the law instead of plucking away on your blog. It wouldn't be good strategy for us to just give you this information because the Dems. would then get a jump on us. We will tell you at our time and place what we will tell you. Have a nice day at your computer plucking away.
ReplyDeleteWhat in the world are you talking about? this is government of the people, for the people and by the people. We are asking you to govern and stop playing petty politics. The dems and the citizens should be invited to be a part of the government. that will benefit us all. A public plan is your only avenue to success.
DeleteAnon Jan 21 @ 7:00--More pompous arrogance. In 2 years, if you do not change your tune, we will tell you what we think and a couple of the new majority will find themselves in the minority.
ReplyDeleteRather than worry who has the drop on who why not do the job you were elected to do. SWF had a clear plan outlined in the advertiser before the election. Why not just implement it. It is not a secret what needs to be done. Political season is over. It can't be a surprise that citizens expect you to do what you said you would do.
ReplyDeleteIt might be time for one of my favorite verses from Edwin Markham:
ReplyDeleteHe drew a circle that shut me out.
Heretic, rebel, a thing to flout.
But love and I had the wit to win.
We drew a circle and took him in!
Be well,
Tom Grant
Dear 7sm, no need to worry about anyone "plucking away all day". I'm pretty sure that most people who blog here are able to enjoy their families, do their work, do volunteer work, and as apart of their civic responsibility, blog. These people are capable of organizing their thoughts quickly and expressing those thoughts clearly. Thanks for your unnecessary concern.
ReplyDeleteTo Anon Jan 21 @----A quote from Margaret Thatcher comes to mind, "Power is like being a lady... if you have to tell people you are, you aren't." Do your jobs, inform the public of what the public is paying for, what your plans are for our tax dollars, how you plan on reducing the deficit, what the aggregate cost savings on payroll was, answer the public's questions at Board meetings. Stop trying to squelch information because that only makes the public more skeptical of you and your agenda. Start doing what you promised. You were against nepotism and cronyism, Chris Defrus proved that claim to be a farce. Work on the Town's issues and stop worrying about private conversations. You wanted a majority now you have a majority so there are no more excuses...do the job.
ReplyDeleteActually most budgets can be lowered if they shift a lot of things to the counties. Including road maintenance. In fact if you divided Rensselaer county into three zones and had a maintenance facility at each one you could reduce the time roads get cleared and town streets get paved. Using something as simple as a computer program you can ascertain difficult areas that need more street cleaning for example hilly streets and government offices. The idea is simple logistics that needs the towns taken out of it and run completely by an independent agency run by the county. At the same time 23000 for a purchaser. Really why not have agencies in charge of their own purchasing all reporting to a full time county purchaser for a tenth of the price. Problem is towns want full autonomy but they want to the citizens to pay for it. Reality is most of the gov't jobs can be outsourced to the counties with field offices if necessary for a fraction of the cost.
ReplyDeleteTo anyone who would like to hear some well thought out arguments in favor of open government I would like to recommend today's Fred Dickert radio show on talk 1300. I'm listening now but the show will be rebroadcast at 6PM on 1300 AM.
ReplyDeleteThe parallels between certain state issues being discussed and the curious position put forth by 7AM (above) are amazing! Enjoy!
Colonie proved some gov't services can be privatized. Another problem is....the politicians want to keep the jobs for their friends and they neglect to realize that maintaining the existing jobs can be part of the contract when they shift to privatization. But the politicians don't want to lose votes so they go with the status quo and never consider the taxpayers savings.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 7:00: If the information in question is not FOILable it's because it's a summary or analysis and not an official output promulgated by public officials. But let's be fair: the reason you won't release it is not some superior political strategy. It's because you never did such an analysis and you don't know the answer to the questions. You have a vague sense that the overall effect of this year's appointments yields a net gain for the taxpayers and you hope to control overtime and curtail costs when you can but you really have no exact idea where we stand at the moment.
ReplyDeleteAnd this cuts to the heart of the problem between blogs and public information held by elected officials. Questions like those raised here are not attacks on elected officials even though that is how they're perceived. They are good questions that a confident administration would hear and say 'that's an analysis worth doing' and then after it's done share with the public. Such an analysis would enhance your ability to make decisions and reach fiscal goals that we all agree are good for the town. Instead, you interpret the asking of substantive questions as somehow a questioning of your authority or a statement about your possible negligence. This majority has been in office for five minutes, nobody expects you to have all the answers. At this point I'm not so much worried about the answers themselves as I am about the adversarial attitude you take to the asking of questions in general.
Our elected representatives are elected to make the decisions that affect town government. But it is still our government, not yours. All levels of American government are designed to be 'of the people, by the people, and for the people.' So far you guys only seem interested in the third clause of that statement. The genius of America, and what makes it the greatest country on earth, are the first two clauses.
Jack---100% in agreement with you and very well articulated. The current "regime" is under the impression American gov't is TO the people and no founding document for this country lists TO the people.
ReplyDeleteAnswer the questions at the Board meetings, provide strategies to implement plans or at least tell us you are working on a plan.
The new majority already has a blemish by appointing their party chairman to a paid position. In less than 30 days they rendered themselves a black eye. It is time to get up and make up for that error in judgement. What is on the agenda for the deficit, how much was saved when some positions were abolished because it seems some positions were filled and received pay increases and it seems we have quite a few attorneys on retainer now so what is the real aggregate cost savings? Explain your positions and decisions when they are questioned. There will never be 100% agreement but if you can explain your position with reason and intellect as well as some quantifiable information than the questions are answered.
To quote Ray Mooney:
ReplyDelete"Here's a simple example from the 2014 Organizational Meeting:
How many town jobs did you add?
How much is that costing taxpayers?
How many jobs did you eliminate?
How much is that savings taxpayers?"
Simple question.
Seems to me that there are two possible reasons that there has not been an answer. First, it's possible that there is a spending increase, which is not something to crow about. If there was a spending decrease, it would have bragging points all over it. The second reason for not answering is that the administration doesn't know the answer. If that's the case (to borrow a term from a good friend), it boarders on malfeasance.
Dear Gadfly 12:59 PM:
ReplyDeleteWhat we do know for sure is we are all paying for a tax increase, due to the intransigence of Supervisor Langley and former Councilperson Rick Matters.
Be well,
Tom
I want to clarify my previous remarks because I don't want to leave the impression that I think the new administration doesn't know what it's doing. The reason I think they don't know the overall impact of the personnel changes is that if they saved us money and they knew how much they would be bragging about it, putting a Commissioner's message to that effect on the website, placing a piece in the Advertiser and just generally shouting it from the mountain top. They're not hiding anything from the democrats and Phil Malone and Sue Mangold can do their own calculations. If they calculated that the overall effect was not to the taxpayers' advantage they would be shouting that from the mountain top. So my guess is we're slightly ahead of last year in saving money. Why not demonstrate that?
ReplyDeleteIt seems that neither side really has a handle on what happened and, as is obvious from the blogs, neither does anyone else. We know some good things happened - the appointments for town attorney, deputy and assistant attorneys, comptroller and assessor all have significant experience in the jobs they now hold. I don't know the DPW commissioner but Dan Fiacco is a good man and if we had to hire a deputy commissioner for DPW he's an excellent choice, Meaghan Hart is Director of Finance and she's proven to be an extremely capable person. Ed Gilbert is very capable as well and a good pick for deputy supervisor. The supervisor has two years experience in the job now and Deb DiMartino and Mary Ann Matters not only won the election but their margin of victory can fairly be described as a mandate to implement their campaign promises. So there's lots of good news.
There are also a lot of questions. It does seem like the republican party chairman is asserting an awful lot of influence over a board that isn't technically a republican board (Keith Langley's an Independent). Although he engineered two rounds of impressive election victories,Chris himself was not elected and should be taking a back seat to the people who were elected. The definition of machine politics is that the machine, not the elected officials, controls what happens. This is what seems to be happening. Other questions include: why a deputy for DPW and were the layoffs used to pay for this? why so many attorneys and pay increases for the planning and zoning board attorneys? why a salary for the deputy supervisor? why the tax increase this year when it seemed Sue Mangold offered them a way out? if Chris is exerting so much influence isn't it bad form for him to accept an appointment? And, of course, the big one: what is the net effect of this administration's start-up on our tax situation.
It's important for critics to remember that good things are happening, and it's important for supporters to remember that these (and others) are valid questions that a responsible and accountable board should answer. It may take them some time but it should be on their agenda. They need to accept the public's right to demand accountability from them and the public needs to give them the time to be accountable.
Jack--Thus was my point in my comment---what is the aggregate cost savings from payroll due to the abolished positions? Since the salaries were raised for some positions and we have so many attorneys on retainer, were the abolishing of positions washed by the increases in salaries and retainers or was there a savings? I am giving the benefit of the doubt that there was no increase.
ReplyDeleteIt is important to note that these questions are not new questions. They are the same questions that were asked of the prior administration. Nobody is raising the bar on transparency or sharing information. There is equitable treatment to both majorities. The previous majority was chastised for nepotism and cronyism so the new majority will suffer the same criticism because they are doing the same thing which also makes them hypocrites.
We would all like to see the new majority succeed because when they succeed, we the people succeed. We saw the decisions of the previous majorities and many of those decisions failed ergo, we the people suffered the damage caused by those decisions. Less than 30 days into it, the new majority has practiced cronyism and refused to answer some of the minority's very legitimate questions at the Board Mtg. If this was the old majority refusing to answer the minority's questions, they would be criticized and in fact, were criticized. When the new majority begins to say what they mean and do what they say we will all be their cheerleaders. Until then, as long as they are hypocrites, they offer us nothing to "get on board with". They are making matters worse by prying into private conversations and attempting to dictate friendships and social gatherings. There is no room for that sort of nonsense in our 24 square mile Town that is so far in debt and imposes such heavy taxes. There are real issues this Town is struggling with.
Dear Mr. Conway,
ReplyDeleteI can't tell you how much the town tax increase grinds my gears. You are absolutely correct. Councilperson Mangold provided an artful way for Supervisor Langley to vote in favor of a no tax increase budget. The fact that Supervisor Langley declined to do so was astonishing and has quite rightly called into question exactly what level of understanding he has about the Town's Financial condition.
Is it also possible that Mr. Langley, after two years of experience as Town Supervisor, and Chief Financial Officer, is really and truly unable to determine the overall fiscal impact of the Chris. Defruscio orchestrated personnel changes?.
Welcome to day 22 of the Smart Way Forward for East Greenbush .things are improving every day. It is to bad Talks and Gadfly feel the need to keep up with all there. whininng . Face it, Keith Langley won and you are on the outs .Why don't you just stay out of government things you no nothing about . Keith is the government ,he was elected by the people there ,I have said what has to be said .
ReplyDeleteYes, indeed, Chris, you have said about all you need to say to keep me involved.
Delete@9:25 AM Keith Langley is NOT the government! The citizens of East Greenbush are the government and they have trusted Keith Langley to be their representative by virtue of his election to the office of Supervisor. The people have the responsibility to guide their elected officials. Keith Langley has a responsibility to be cooperative with those who elected him. Surly and secretive will not work in government (think Richard Nixon).
DeleteHey anonymous at 9:25 AM. If Langley is the government as you say, why can't he answer a simple e-mail? Or for that matter why can't anyone of the elected officials? At least answer me, even if you lie. At least it would be an acknowledgement.
Delete9:25 you are right.
ReplyDeletethings are improving every day.
every day that passes puts us that much closer to 11/3/15.
10:13 says Langley is not the government. damned right he's not and neither is the little boy behind the curtain defcon
Back in the day, people used to write on walls "Clapton is G-D." It seems as if @9:25 wants us to believe "Langley is G-D."
ReplyDeleteto Jim_C--suggest you email Phil and Sue. Right now they are the most responsive. Email them directly.
ReplyDeleteThey got the same e-mail along with all of them, and they all got it twice. Mr. Gilbert has finally returned my e-mail. Thank you Mr. Gilbert.
DeleteBoys and Girls....listen up....yesterday Mr. DeFruscio sent out an emissary with the message that he'd shut down EGDemands if I shut down the Gadfly. Seems to me that we're hitting the target, doncha think? (I have the e-mails by the way) The only thing DeF was elected to was a Party position, so those of you who are being intimidated by the guy should remember that. He was not elected to the Town Board. He's only as powerful as those who roll-over for him. All they need to do to shut him off is stand up to him. He's got nothing.
ReplyDeleteAnother one boys and girls.....Mr. DeF has taken down his assertion that Mr. Langley is the government.....(unless I missed it).
ReplyDeleteMr. Gilbert should be more attentive to his monitoring job.
DeleteGadfly, keith is the government statment is in the 9:25 above on this blog.
DeleteHe took it down on his DEMands blog.
DeleteYes, the first two posts used to have 8 and 12 comments respectively. How they have 5 and 11 if I read it right. They've been deleting right and left. Chrissy under fire??
DeleteThank you Mr. Gilbert for getting back to me. That is all I was looking for is some type of acknowledgement. I do appreciate finally getting a return.
ReplyDeleteThank you.
Well ,hear we are with day 23 smart Way Forward .Keith Langley is still the Supervisor ,and heis doing fine. .Evryone is happy but the gagflies and Talkers and you our all Bunch of Crybabes .What is wrong with Keith Langley is the government ? he is you no . That is all for today .
ReplyDelete17 more days and you'll run out of fingers and toes to count on
Deletethen what will you do?
9:48 AM-Thank you. You gave me the best laugh I have had in days. Thanks again.
ReplyDeleteDear Gadfly
ReplyDeleteThere's a terrific piece in today's Times-Union, by Alysia Santo, about newly elected Albany Mayor Kathy Sheehan's proposals to address the City of Albany's structural deficit. Well worth a close look.
Be well,
Tom
Thanks Tom!! An excellent example of how an administration should tackle problems and relate to the public at-large. There's a local lesson in there somewhere.....
ReplyDeletehttp://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Challenges-and-changes-ahead-5170438.php
Today's Chuckle: A Snippet of Stupid...
ReplyDelete"********************************************************************************************************************************** ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT ALERT
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TALKS and the Gadfly have crashed! Blogspot is having server issues. Please keep an eye out for zombie like DUHmocrats wandering along the roads."
Why don't you guys just get about the implementation of the agenda you outlined in the campaign, instead of worrying so much about blogging? Therein lies your future. Ethics Code update would be a start. That was promised in January Mr. Supervisor.
Just remembered something: weren't we supposed to have AUD results from the last three years by now, in preparation for hand-off to the audit agency? As part of the November meeting we were told that 2010 and 20111 were done, and 2012 was expected to be complete by 11/27/13. Then, when I met with the Supervisor shortly after this, I was told that rather than release the 2012 results immediately the Supervisor and Comptroller (and Board, I presume) were going to spend an extra month analyzing the results before sending all three years off to Toski for audit. That would mean we're a month behind the "month behind" schedule we were led to believe would happen? I just visited the Comptroller download section of the Town's web site- nothing there about AUD's. I'll be sending an e-mail reminder to the Supervisor, but some of you may want to express your own interest as well? Dwight Jenkins
ReplyDeleteDwight, I have expressed my interest many times since 2010 but most recently at the November and the January Town Board meetings. In November I received the answer you describe above and in January I received no answer whatsoever.
DeleteHold your horses, people. I e-mailed the Supervisor at 4:45-ish and he got back to me within 30 minutes. He said it's been a busy month, with all the transitions, and he invited me to stop in next week to talk to him and to the new Comptroller about this. I think that's a pretty damn fast response, so thank you sir, and I'll see you next week.
ReplyDeleteDwight Jenkins
Excellent!!
DeleteTo Dwight and the Gadfly: Huh? What is excellent about this scenario? This is information all the residents of East Greenbush have paid for (more than once if you count the auditor hired to help the auditor and the add on's). I appreciate Dwight's efforts and his tenacity but lets all remember that more than one resident has an interest in the AUD's and the Audit. Perhaps the time and place of this meeting should be published so that interested residents can see for themselves. Perhaps the volunteer members of CFAC who have worked so hard to make the fiscal picture in our Town better should be invited. Perhaps the members of the Town Board should be invited. Why in the world would the Supervisor make a meeting on the very long overdue audits with one resident? Unless the Supervisor plans on asking Dwight for help with the roll out of the audits (which is actually a pretty good idea) make this information available to all, period.
DeleteWell I'd say that it beats living in the bunker worrying about the blogs. It takes a while to get free of the "machine" mentality which EG has lived with for so many years. If Mr. Langley wants to break free from that style it's a good day. Truth be told, his re-election depends on it.
DeleteAt least you get reply's from him
DeleteMaybe the Gadfly could accompany Dwight with his webcam to film the exchange so the residents unable to attend would have an opportunity to view the Keith-Dwight discussion on you tube.
ReplyDeleteI'm thinking Nixon-Frost...
Keith sees whoever asks him, I suppose. Let's not make Dwight (me) the bad guy in this, I'm simply exercising my right as a taxpayer, same as all of you. Go see him yourself, but you're not coming with me. I ask questions sometimes, I get answers sometimes, and I write about them sometimes. Think Town Park sewage, $100,000 library tiles, $40,000 botched library tax appropriation, Wastewater Treatment Plant Orders on Consent, phony County Health Dept. rationale for the Thompson Way development, Town Garage buried fuel tank Order on Consent, blah blah blah. It goes on and on. Nothing special, just asking, FOILing, putting the pieces together, writing. Sometimes right, sometimes wrong. Whatever. Anybody who doesn't like it can go do it themselves. I belong to no party, have no agenda, which is exactly what I told Keith last time I met with him. He seemed not to care one way or another. I'm looking out for MY money. You look out for yours however you see fit, but stay away from me while you do it. By the way, it doesn't work well if you don't put your name on the questions or the results. Dwight Jenkins
ReplyDelete@ Rovin4life: The development of shared services and consolidation is exactly the really, really smart way forward! Not only will concepts like yours develop immediate savings in the current budget, but they could qualify the town for Governor Cuomo's newly proposed state-subsidized property tax freeze and circuit breaker on the property taxes of owners with fixed incomes. Property taxes ARE the most pressing issue in East Greenbush and I would like to hear that our town elected officials are willing to be first in line to support enactment of the proposal and then seek the shared service agreements and consolidation that will bring property tax relief to the town residents.
ReplyDeleteReality is if local govt was treated like a franchise instead of a little kingdom, tax savings would go thru the roof. Do politicians like to fill jobs with friends absolutely not. They have no choice. its their political friends that got them there in the first place. They could not have gotten to power without them. Its a vicious cycle. Reality is Cuomo is asking them to give up the one thing that gives them power. Its like cutting off a finger. I bet if you got all the towns together and the county together to see where they could get a solution to the problems you will find it will be easier to work together. For example do we need a town attorney or are we better off with a pool of attorneys for the county. Troy probably needs its own attorney but at the same time having a pool of attorneys you get more bang for you buck cause you hire them at a better rate. Plus you may be able to use one or two for the entire county and then have a paralegal for other correspondents.
ReplyDeleteYou wouldn't save a dime. The state would take your money and simply grow their big kingdom. You are being naive.
DeleteDear 11:24 AM
ReplyDeletePlease share with us your factual basis for your statement. Or, are you merely offering an opinion?
Businesses and unions have been consolidating for decades. Consolidation produces simple, basic economies of scale.
How, within a consolidation of town and county services, does the state "take your money"? Your comment makes no business sense to me.
Just an opinion. Appears to be an example of government growing their own empire at the state level. An opinion not based at all on good business sense but in observance of political greed.
DeleteStates can shrink payrolls easier without the appearance of not getting work done. If you have two thousand employees in a dept and you need to get rid of one percent its easy and won't affect the output. You can't get one percent in a town when you have twenty or less employees. You end up with lots of issues. But when you consolidate and share services you end removing unnecessary waste in the form of part time workers that would be better suited working full time. Not only do you save money consolidating workers but having a central location allows less people to operate and building maintenance is reduced. I work in the private sector. Either we consolidate or go into the red. Then we are all out of a job. Politicians need to understand the daily job of running a govt can be handed off to a centralized location allowing for leaner numbers and happier voters. They can spend the extra money on things like good will and community service to enrich the lives of community members. It doesn't take much. You have to be committed to eliminating the human factor and see it as providing a service. Eliminating the human factor aka politics you give yourself room to grow and voters to like you. It is dangerous but leading comes from making the right decision no matter who gets pissed off.
ReplyDeleteReal Classy (not!!) photo on the Chris DeFruscio DEMands Blog. How can Chris believe this reflects well on the Langley SWF majority? Why don't they stop these juvenile antics and start governing?? Is doing the work the people elected them to do too hard for them??
ReplyDeleteThanks Anonymous....but we've seen this kind of juvenile behavior before, haven't we. Langley could tell him to get lost. Mr. DeFruscio is not elected to anything but a Party post. The new majority should cut itself loose from the Chair and start governing......if they have the where with all. It's up to the Supervisor to decide that he can function without direction from the Chair.
DeleteFirst, poetry from Langley in his December Supervisor's report and now a childish photo on his Boss's (Chris DeF) blog. What's next? Crude sound effects from the dais at the next Board meeting? For Pete sakes, Grow up Keith and Chris.
DeleteWhy don't they put Gilbert to work writing something of substance. Take that Kojak sucker out of his mouth and put him to work.
DeleteWhat's really tragic (in addition to the juvenile stuff) is that the apparent policy outlet for the administration is rejecting the initiative before they've even read it. In addition to that, there's no sound logic in rejecting the tried and true practices which support the initiative. The administration would do well to think before speaking.
ReplyDeleteBased on the most recent comment on the DeFruscio andLangley run DEMands blog, it sure looks like they don't like looking ahead or try to plan for issues "on what may be down the road." What a way to run a government. Although, it does fit with what someone previously posted about Langley: "He knows what he knows and that's it."
ReplyDeleteAnd that is sad...
Nice piece in today's Times-Union describing how Albany Mayor Kathy Sheehan plans to have the City of Albany go before the state's Financial Restructuring Board to seek up to $ 5 Million in State aid to help modernize the City of Albany's operations. Here's an interesting quote from Mayor Sheehan: "We are where we are, and to me it's not about recriminations around how we got here. It's about what we do to avoid the cliff, in 2015."
ReplyDeleteSheehan, according to the article written by Jordan-Carleo-Evangalist,, "said the restructuring board funding could be used to improve the city's IT infrastructure, which would help it make more informed decisions about how to allocate city resources and where cuts could be made without unwanted or unintended consequences for vital services."
Kudos to Albany Mayor Sheehan, her administration really seems to have hit the ground running.
The Sheehan admin has hit the ground running, while the Defruscio, Langley DEMands admin has just hit the ground.
ReplyDeleteIt's really a tragedy that Langley/DeFruscio are spending so much "intellectual" capital on the blogging enterprise. Even WEB expertise is getting paid in cash. Very limited resources spent on attempted ridicule when the thinking caps should be on charting the future course of the Town. There's still a list of campaign promises published in the Advertiser which is waiting for a time-table.
ReplyDeleteMore ignorance from the Chrissie blog; Claims that when the plows go out, the guys automatically get 4 hrs ot, no matter how long they work. Wrong! only on holidays is that true. It is an automatic 2 hrs. It's a moot point usually anyway, since there isn't a run in this town that can be done in less than 3 hrs. Sorry E.Chris, Ed or whomever your designated writer is over there. Shouldn't you guys know the rules by now??
ReplyDeleteAnother classless, vulgar and juvenile illustration on the DEMands blog. Is that what passes for thoughtful discourse from Supervisor Langley?
ReplyDeleteDwight Jenkins
ReplyDeleteJanuary 24, 2014 at 4:41 PM proudly proclaims his diligence in pursuing the status of the AUD and the Audits
January 24, 2014 at 5:35 PM proudly proclaims that the Supervisor has seen fit to honor him with a meeting
January 24, 2014 at 10:56 PM takes umbrage at the suggestion that others meet with he and the Sup and climbs on his high horse as if he’s the only one who cares
Grow up Dwight!
Don, is it too late to mention that I think I was the first one, outside the last administration and their accountants, to take note of and write about the missing $400,000 (approximate, based on previous year) fuel usage numbers on the 2010 AUD? I'm sorry, I should have included that earlier, damn it, but I was just shooting from the hip. So, 9:58 Anonymous, who should I emulate? You? Give me a name, maybe I'll try to grow up big and strong like you! Until then I'll remain immature, I guess. And proud. Yours, Dwight Jenkins
ReplyDeleteDwight's notes from his meeting with the Supervisor are up here:
ReplyDeletehttp://eastgreenbushdreams.wordpress.com/2014/01/29/12814-supervisor-meeting/
Take a look!!!
Dwight. Nice article
ReplyDeleteBut does anyone have an idea when Toski's audits will be completed? Didn't the Supervisor push them back from December to the beginning of this month?
I think AUDs are different from Audits although they should reflect the same data.
Indeed, Annual Update Documents are the building blocks for our audits, which is why we don't have any to date. The audits have been pushed back in response to delayed AUD results, but we finally have everything we need from Wojeski, apparently. When will the audits happen? Nothing definite to report on that. It did come up in conversation, I did ask, but no firm commitments to a deadline yet. The impression I got was that the new comptroller wanted to pore over the AUD papers before anything was finalized. He does not appear to be someone willing to rubber-stamp anything that will require his signature. I think many would agree that this is a nice quality to have in a comptroller. At least I do. Opinions will vary I suppose. We filed them timely for many years. They were grossly inaccurate, in hindsight, leading to fiscal chaos, but they were in fact timely. From my high horse, Dwight Jenkins, the only one who really cares about our town. L O L
Deletewhat does AUD stand for?
DeleteAnnual Update Document. It's an uncertified compilation of the Town's financial statements required to be submitted to the State Comptroller.
DeleteDear Gadfly and Dwight:
ReplyDeletePlease correct me if I'm wrong. My read of Dwight's recent post is that the Supervisor has put ethics reform on the back burner until the audit and sewer issues are resolved. I hope my analysis is incorrect and the new Smart Way Forward Majority majority will proceed apace and fulfill their campaign promise to: "Pass an Ethics Law that requires the hiring of employees to be based on merit, not on friendships and family relationships."
I'm sure the Town Board and their hard working staff is quite capable of concentrating on more than two issues at a time.
Be well,
Tom
Tom, I think your analysis is not incorrect based on my notes and leaking memory. I think I reported the administration's position accurately. Dwight
DeleteDwight,
DeleteMany thanks.
Tom
Maybe somebody needs to look at what provisions of the original draft ethics code were violated in the appointments made at the Organizational Meeting. Might that be the reason for the back-burnering of the whole matter?
Delete@ 7:17 PM,
DeleteSupervisor Langley is happy to answer any questions, except at Town Board meetings.
Tom Grant is right on the money. Quoting Dwight,
DeleteIn fact, he said that getting the books right was his administration’s top priority
Second highest on the list of administration priorities? The new Wastewater Treatment Plant.
Ethics will probably be looked at again once administration priorities are satisfied.
"Pass an Ethics Law that requires the hiring of employees to be based on merit, not on friendships and family relationships." ???
ReplyDeleteI think that ship has pretty much sailed.
Looks like "Letty" needs to get to work on the Town website as opposed to the DEMands blog offering.
ReplyDeleteMy Gosh, the DeFruscio/Langley DEMands blog is getting even more odd. If only they would put some effort in bringing people together instead of always trying to divide them.
ReplyDeleteDoesn't Langley care about anything but himself and DeFruscio.
Strange behavior indeed.
The utterly gross and tasteless "presentation" on DEMands has really gone over the edge. Of course, we may see denials about whether the administration has anything to do with it.. I've heard them. On the other hand, nature abhors a vacuum. So if the administration had a "real" site out there with some substantive content, there would be some plausible deniabillity.
DeleteTime for the ELECTED majority to put the Chair out to pasture, take control and start to govern, free of the Chair's agenda. There's just no future on the current path.
DeleteGreat article in the Advertiser, Pete. I only wish that the new administration had some concept of public relations and marketing so that they had been able to do a real good explanatory "roll-out" of its plans. We encouraged it twice on this blog.
ReplyDeleteThere is one problem which you might want to check. You cite Section 52 of NYS Town Law in relation to the basis of some on your argument at the end on your letter. Sounds like you are assuming that East Greenbush is a "Suburban Town" within the definitions of the Law. I think EG is a Town of the First Class, and Sections 50 - 57A may not apply. Worth checking.
Thanks, Don.
ReplyDeleteI think you've known me long enough to know I rarely assume anything. I checked with Linda Kennedy before writing ... the Town Board voted in March 1967 to become a Suburban Town effective 1/1/68.
Pete Stenson
If that's the case, I think an argument could be made, based on the language of the law, that the Supervisor is liaison to all town departments. Seems that much more executive authority and responsibility is invested in a Supervisor of a Suburban Town than in a Town of the First or Second Class. Of course the Bill Jacket containing the Legislative Intent and Bill Memos for the revision of Town Law done some years ago has disappeared from the State Library. The last the State Librarian knows is that it was in the possession of the Governor's Office.
DeleteDon,
DeleteThe NYS DOS Local Government Handbook states:
By delegating a few more specific powers, the Suburban Town Law gives the supervisor a bit more authority. Although designated as chief executive officer,” however, the Suburban Town supervisor has no major new executive powers.
The Association of Towns' Town Law Manual appears to be silent on any Suburban Town Supervisor's additional powers.
Pete Stenson
interesting article
ReplyDeleteInside Politics: County ethics update ends oversight
By Alysia Santo
Published 9:15 pm, Thursday, January 30, 2014
http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Inside-Politics-County-ethics-update-ends-5191213.php
Dear 4:56 AM:
DeleteThanks for the post and the link to the article. Alysia Santo is a terrific reporter very well versed on a number of Town of East Greenbush issues.
Be well,
Tom
EG DEMands is warning people away from EG Talks claiming they are tracing IP addresses. I guess what goes around comes around since at one point Talks was claiming the Gadfly was doing that. I have a real simple solution that renders this fear irrelevant - use your real name!!!!! But since both Talks and DEMands won't even reveal the moderators of their blogs they deserve to wallow in their own paranoia. Imagine being an adult and being worried that someone might find out who you are?
ReplyDeleteIt is fascinating to me that a supposedly mature new majority in EG would allow itself to be associated with the juvenile stuff going on on DEMands without any protest or opposition - or a replacement. Mr. Langley, do you call the shots for your administration? You certainly have to be reading and looking at what's being posted. Do you agree with what is there, attributed to your administration? I certainly agree that Talks needs to be criticized, but from the same cesspool that they posted from? Time to grow up in EG, don't you think? Let's start talking about issues.
ReplyDeleteWell Ray, you just got a convoluted, disjointed and un-reasoned response to your comment on the DEMands blog. If they had anything, they'd be out there with a mature, well-reasoned and concise statement of the administration's goals, objectives and timetables. What we get is cartoons. Mr. Langley needs to develop some credibility and gravitas. The path he's permitting to his partisans is not achieving that for him. But, of course, the perpetrating partisans are telling him a different story. Surround yourself with sycophants and you get a sycophantic chorus. A reading of "The Emperor's New Clothes" might be in order.
ReplyDeleteDear 9:24 PM- and Mr. Langley has put Ethics reform on the shelf. So much for credibility and gravitas.
ReplyDeletesince DUHmands likes definitions how's this one
ReplyDeletesoph·o·mor·ic
having or showing a lack of emotional maturity
foolish and immature conceited and overconfident of knowledge but poorly informed and immature
apologies to the sophomores at CHS most of whom are more mature than the DUHmands crowd
Just when you thought the Langley/DeFruscio Gadfly blog couldn't get more bizarre ...
ReplyDeleteIs this what Keith Langley wants to be remembered for?
Looks like Letty's loose.....
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 7:31: I'm not thrilled with the new format of EG DEMands, mostly because I think you should show some class when you win. I always wonder if people are afraid of questions because they don't know the answers but in the interests of fair play I do have to ask: how did Chris DeFruscio steal an election? You don't have to like the result but the last election was pretty conclusive.
ReplyDeleteRumor, innuendo , false statements and promises of NO patronage,nepotism or cronyism. I am positive you have all the campaign literature and letters written into the Advertiser. The one in particular written-(?) by Anthony Corellis where he chastises the past administration for exactly what the SWF team has put into place! Mainly he himself supervising a somewhat direct relative - Missy Nusbaum !
ReplyDeleteThe false promises of NO TAX INCREASE.was a big vote getter....and yet Langley has no idea what that phrase means ! Hiring on your pals and buddies and giving each of them hefty pay increases to boot ! At what point do any or all of us call B-S !?
7:31: It's still too early to call most of it BS but even if I accept all that you say he didn't steal the election. If questionable tactics and false promises constitute theft then probably every election in this country in the last 20 years has been stolen. There's no doubt that the first organizational meeting looked like more of the same in terms of insider politics but accusing someone of stealing an election is a serious, and in this case wildly unsubstantiated, charge.
ReplyDeleteNot literally...just a phrase... So sorry for the confusion. As a life long resident and former Town employee, this is by far the worst I've ever seen moral and dysfunction of a sitting Town Board majority.
DeleteYou can try to be optimistic. I look at it from a completely different persepective.
Fair enough. I always try to be optimistic. Morale is low partly because of the change in administration. People have had good friends and colleagues laid off and they are adjusting to a new chain of command. I'm not saying things will be great but they'll get better as everyone gets used to each other. It's way too early to know how the new majority will fare. The test will be in our tax rate, debt status and the delivery of essntiall services. And, of course, the ethical conduct of town officials.
DeleteJack....I think the guy may mean stealing CREDIT for the election. Mr. DeFruscio has convinced himself and some around him that the Dems didn't fall of their own weight. But he knows the real truth, and that's one of the reasons for the irrational antipathy toward those who have fought for reform. Can't think of anything else which would explain the juvenile behavior on that other blog.
ReplyDeleteChris is Chris, he is what he is. My major concern as a Town taxpayer and resident is that Supervisor Langley seems to be enabling this juvenile behavior. Mr. Langley doesn't seem to realize that people expect a certain level of civility from their elected officials. Especially those serving in a full time taxpayer paid position.
ReplyDeleteI was reminded recently by a friend of what Ann Richards said of George H. W. Bush: "he woke up on third base and thought he'd hit a triple." Apt in this case.
ReplyDeleteDear Linda.....The passage of the original Ethics Code was promised in January during the campaign.
ReplyDeleteDear Stupid is as Stupid Does..... From the September 26th Advertiser, Page 2: "If elected, Deb and I promise to bring the ethics law back in front of the board in January, to review and amend those sections that are weak." Ms. Matters goes on to list three restorations to be done with the code, with attention to nepotism and patronage.
ReplyDeleteWith reference to whose "fingerprints" are on what is happening in Town Hall, here's a quote from an e-mail I got on Saturday from a certain un-elected shot caller: "As you can see when I and my friends put our efforts in the right places things get done ." Maybe you should ask him if I should publish the whole thing.
So I guess Stupid is as Stupid does. Why don't you just get down to the business of governing with some accountability and transparency? Your current behavior does nothing but invite more and more of the questions you want to quell.
But, on the bright side, it is good to see he Administration stepping away from Chris and ironic that they are doing it on the blog he started. The biggest irony of all is that blog author calling anyone stupid. That blog's authors have published poor grammar, bad English, 3rd grade toilet humor, and deliberate misrepresentation (as in we are the DEM's).
DeleteBy the way, Don, I think the writer of that blog couldn't understand the post you directed to Linda. He was thinking that the promise was made in a January campaign and not that during the political campaign SWF made a promise to take action on Ethics in January. Yet that blogger calls other people names. Langley must be very proud.
It’s very clear that DUHmands raison d'être is to attack those who disagree with the majority, regardless of the truth. Attack those who seek and speak the truth and do anything to discredit them and protect their ‘almighty’ leaders.
ReplyDeleteThey exist to distract us from their majority and what they are doing to the Town.
I suggest we neither take their bait nor engage these majority mouthpieces. Give them no time on Talks or Gadfly. Keep Gadfly and Talks focused on the issues.
But step up the efforts and submit articles to The Advertiser … reach out to a broader audience. Gadfly, either of the “This Space Available” articles would make fine submissions.
It's easy to point the finger at Chris. But remember, that blog wouldn't exist without the approval of Keith Langley. Mr. Langley is the elected Supervisor of this Town and Ed Gilbert is his appointed Deputy Supervisor. Although the Keith and Chris bromance seems very genuine and even somewhat endearing; ,this is all about Keith Langley and not Chris.
ReplyDeleteSo each blog has to have a puppet master? By your logic talks is controlled by who ? Malone ? And what political arm controls this blog?
DeleteDear Not Buying It.....Much to the frustration of the folks who live in the outdated political culture of our Town, understanding that something like this could exist without being "controlled" by a political arm is difficult. Fact is that the major contributors to this blog come from across the entire political spectrum....Independents, Conservatives, Liberals, Republicans, Democrats..... I guess you could say that regardless of political affiliation, we are all interested in reform in government and accountable and transparent governmental operations. Sometimes this perspective drives those attempting to govern in the "old" way nuts. That's why we see so much of the personal attack. Sometimes they just don't get it. The old ways are really over, but it takes a while for that to sink in. Like I've said before a couple of times. The old ways are just too expensive.
DeleteCongratulations to DPW for jumping all over this storm!! I left EG for Delmar at 7:30am, and the EG streets I encountered were in good shape. Delmar was another matter at 8:00am. A real mess over there. A bunch hadn't even been touched yet.
ReplyDeleteGadfly,
ReplyDeleteWe all come from different political spectrum's as you pointed out, but we can all agree on a few things, ethics, morals, integrity to name a few. Sometimes that means doing the opposite of what their perspective party wants them to do, but as of yet there doesn't seem to be too much of that, maybe in time.
Check this out from Alysia Santo in today's TU. The City of Albany is moving ahead with the State's Financial Restructuring Board.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.timesunion.com/default/article/Inside-Politics-State-review-of-Albany-books-5211730.php
Well that's fabulous, what does an Albany county city have to do with a Rensselaer county town?
ReplyDeleteWell, I believe that it is the East Greenbush administration's intent to pursue the same resource for our little Town.
DeleteRight you are, Gadfly. They passed a resolution (152-2013) in October, 2013. Shortly thereafter the public received a verbal report from the then Comptroller, Mr Stenson that the application for this program required completed audits. At the January 2014 Board Meeting I asked the Board for updated information about both the audits and the financial restructuring program. All 5 Board Members missed that opportunity to report to the people. I will be asking this month with the hope of a. better result.
DeleteThe intresting thing here is that a new administration in Albany is proudly proclaiming their efforts to take part in this exiting program. East Greenbush has a new administration that won't reply about the program when asked.
ReplyDeleteIt is not okay for them to be fumbling around without a plan at this point. They should have taken advantage of the transition period to make a fiscal plan and.at this point. they should be bringing it to the people and implemening it.
@8:08 AM- Great post. I beg to disagree with you on one point. There WAS a bit of a fiscal plan advanced during the transition period by Mr. Langley.
ReplyDeleteRemember, Mr. Langley and former Councilperson Rick Matters in effect, voted to increase the Town's taxes for 2014. Without any meaningful discussion and analysis, Supervisor Langley and then Councilperson Rick Matters rejected a reasonable compromise by Councilperson Mangold, which would have eliminated the Tax Increase.
That's the Langley fiscal plan. NO DISCUSSION, NO ANALYSIS, TAX AND SPEND!!
I was at that meeting and the pre-board before it. The pre-board is the place for the type of negotiations that Mangold and Malone were attempting. If only one of them had showed up! Also let's not rewrite history. The budget that we currently have was passed by the previous Bandits M.O.M. What they were attempting to do was not take responsibility for the mess THEY created. The Supervisor gave them the opportunity for a Mea Culpa but they refused to accept responsibility for THEIR OWN ACTIONS! If anyone is guilty of " NO DISCUSSION, NO ANALYSIS, TAX AND SPEND" it's the MOM Gang.
DeleteBottom line, in that little tableau what we got was political posturing on BOTH sides and the people paying the bills got shafted.
DeleteIs there someone out there who can explain why my East Greenbush residential tax levy increased by 2.7 percent from last year while my assessed property value decreased by almost $8,000? Is this another part of the Langley fiscal plan? Tax levy increases and decreased property values? Thanks a lot Mr. Langley.
ReplyDelete@ 2:21 PM, It shouldn't bet about an "opportunity for a Mea Culpa." It is/was Supervisor Langley's responsibility to govern. The most important part of governing is consensus building. Supervisor Langley said he did not want a tax increase,. Supervisor Langley failed to lead the Board to achieve a consensus when a consensus was handed to him. Supervisor Langley chose to put a "Mea Culpa" from Malone and Mangold before the interests of the Taxpayers of East Greenbush. That is not leadership, it is childishness and the East Greenbush taxpayers are now paying for his foolishness.
ReplyDeleteAnd how does he lead or build consensus by allowing Mangold and Malone to rewrite history?
DeleteThere were lots of ways the tax cut could have been accomplished in the Parties had not been so interested in strutting around. The Supe's original budget had the cut. No doubt helped for the election. The Dems responded with an increase, saying the revenue numbers were flawed. Then Ginny left the Board. The restoration of the the tax cut would require a majority or the tax increase would take place for lack of a majority. So did Langley/Matters put language in their restoration resolution which they knew would be distasteful to Malone/Mangold so their restoration would fail and they'd get a tax increase to play with? Was the move by Mangold to vote for the decrease if they removed the language genuine? Anybody who was paying attention could have lined up the ducks in favor of the PEOPLE if they had wanted to. They just spent time playing with each other. Not good.
DeleteAnd then Langley and Matters could have printed something in the Advertiser saying that they acted for the people in abandoning the language in their resolution. Would have worked.....unless the SWF wanted the extra cash for this year. Do ya think?
DeleteDear Sword and Pardon,
ReplyDeleteI also attended the Board meeting with the restoration resolution. Councilperson Mangold, whatever her motives were, spoke and explained her positions on the two amendments to the resolution which if enacted, would have resulted in no tax increase for the people of East Greenbush.
Supervisor Langley had nothing to say about either the Resolution or the proposed amendments. The EG taxpayers deserved to hear an explanation from their Supervisor.
Again, Mr. Langley said nothing, leaned over to look at Councilperson (Rick) Matters as if he was waiting for instruction on how he should vote. You could have heard a pin drop in the room at that moment. Then after Mr. Matters quickly shook his head no. Mr. Langley voted no.
Clearly, Mr. Langley had/has? no idea on how to lead and build consensus on important issues affecting the pocketbooks and wallets of EG taxpayers.
Not good, Mr. Langley. Not good at all.
@6:30 Completely disagree the pre-board and the week leading up to the board meeting was the time to talk about changes to the resolution. this is just another example of the Dems waiting until the last minute to bring their "ideas" to the table.
ReplyDeleteHere's the language on the Town website related to agendas:
Delete"Meeting agendas are TENTATIVE and subject to change, even in rare cases, up until time of each actual meeting."
I've been at Board meetings during which the language of resolutions has been negotiated and changed during the meeting. In this particular case an offer was made to keep the tax cut thru the removal of (pejorative?) language. Didn't happen. Could have.
To S & P on 2/8 at 6:30 p.m. You take a vote on one resolution and then post that "Clearly, Mr. Langley had/has no idea on how to lead and build consensus on important issues affecting the pocketbooks and wallets of EG taxpayers." But isn't that a hell of a rediculous leap? And how are you qualified to make such a statement? That's what I intensely dislike about this blog. Anonymous statements that are just mean-spirited and totally obnoxious are published for all to see and read. But how about being a little more discerning, Gadfly, about what is published. Isn't that what an unbiased blog host would do? Or do you have an ax to grind to?
ReplyDeleteDear Anonymous... This unbiased blog host just published your opinion to the contrary. Blogs are places for opinions, and as I think Pete Stenson would say, "opinions vary." My own opinion is that Mr. Langley could be getting better advice on the roll-out of the Smart Way Forward. He'd capture a lot more support with a different approach.
DeleteIn my opinion, if you want "mean spirited and totally obnoxious" there are a couple of other blogs I could refer you to.
I am a person who once believed that Keith wanted to lower our taxes. I was shocked to see that he voted for a raise in taxes because he favors some language that has no real impact on our lives. It is most certainly not a leap to conclude that Langley missed a leadership opportunity. It is the only conclusion to make. Why he would do such a thing is a big qustion but there is no question about his failed leadership.
DeleteActually, G/adfly,
ReplyDeleteI prefer "opinions are like, err noses, everybody's got one".
Pete Stenson
Thanks Pete. I think we're dealing lately with some real "juvies." I hope we can pull this mess out of the gutter sometime soon.
ReplyDeleteDear 4:05 AM,
ReplyDeleteI couldn't agree more. It is important to remember that most people have a good sense of what drives Chris DeFruscio. Chris is what he is.
I was also once a supporter of Keith Langley. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. I believe, based on his two plus years of non-performance and six weeks of observing him and his requested majority, he does not possess the temperament and intelligence to govern in a fair and balanced manner during these difficult times.
Unless there is a demonstrable and dramatic change in Mr. Langley's behavior in the near future, he will not have our family's support in the next election.
It's up to you Mr. Langley, not Gilbert or DeFruscio. Please prove me wrong, if you are able.
The truth is that no one could run the town to your satisfaction, Gadfly. If God himself was the town Supervisor, you would still find fault. After all, criticisms are what keep your blog in business. You used to be fair and balanced but no longer. Now it's just a lot of sour grapes. I know that because you haven't given the new administration enough time to accomplish anything of any real significance but you're right there anyway criticizing them for anything and everything you can think of. Your blog is just a milder version of TALKS. They've been in control for six weeks, Gadfly! Six weeks!! Rome wasn't built in a day.
ReplyDeleteHow fascinating. Rick McCabe used to say the EXACT same thing. Only his claim was that people would criticize him even if he invented the cure for cancer.
DeleteLook, get real. The early results based on the demonstration of focus in the organizational meeting is not good. Not good at all.
The aftermath is worse. People asked simply if the organizational changes spent taxpayers' money or saved taxpayers money? Simple question right?
The result has been some of the most insanely stupid DEMands blog postings created by DeFruscio and Gilbert in town blogging history.
Okay, 6:05 PM your so smart and knowledgeable. When will Langley produce measurable benefits and results? Around what issues?
Share that and gain some credibility. You will be light years ahead of DeFruscio and Gilbert.
We're not trying to build Rome here. All that needs to be done is run the municipality in a businesslike mature way. To borrow a perception from a friend, it's been run so far like the Howard Stern show. Take a look at DEMands. Totally unnecessary energy expenditure. The Deputy Supervisor could have kept busy producing the analysis of the financial impact of the Organizational Meeting instead of managing cartoons and libel.
ReplyDeleteThere was a six week period after the election during which a transition team could have been gathered to formulate strategy and time lines for the immediate tasks to be accomplished. There still has been no articulation of what the administrations goals are - except for what Dwight was able to find out in conversation.
By the way, I'm not the author of all the opinions posted here. I know some are from the dissatisfied from the last administration. The fact is that the current administration rejected out of hand ready help from a whole bunch of people who supported change in East Greenbush and took a dive into the bunker. That's not the way to govern and build consensus.
It's a shame Mr. Langley seems to be squandering his asked for majority. The Gadfly makes a very good point. Why won't Supervisor Langley issue a detailed report providing the taxpayers with an analysis of the financial impact of his Organizational Meeting?
ReplyDelete@ 6:05 - You say the new administration has not had enough time to accomplish anything. I did not hear anyone calling for accomplishments at this point. There are many calls for a plan, or goals and objectives, or the open government that was promised. Mr. Langley is a full time paid employee. He is obligated to explain his vote to raise taxes especially when it is contrary to his stated goal of reducing taxes. He is obligated to explain projected savings (or increases) when he implements sweeping staffing changes. He will never accomplish anything if he does not have measureable objectives to evaluate his expected accomplishments.
ReplyDeletePlease move away from thinking of questions as criticism. Most of the questions here are only questions. If you have access to Mr. Langley please ask him to buckle down and meet his obligations. He is the guy who ran for the job of Supervisor, not the Gadfly.
Langley whined for two years to anyone and everyone about not having a majority. Now he does. The result? Take a look at the DEMands blog and see for yourself.
ReplyDeletePeople who asked questions and made suggestions have been made fun of in the very worst traditions of the Talks blog.
Great, so now we have proof that DeFruscio and Gilbert are exactly like Halloran and Malone.
How deeply disturbing.
Is what we have seen so far all you got supervisor Langley?
I thought it might help to provide an example of why questions are asked and what makes them stop. It will, hopefully, disabuse folks of the notion nothing will satisfy the bloggers and the notion that a question is a criticism. Here goes:
ReplyDeleteSome time ago there was a crisis involving waste water treatment (WWT) in East Greenbush. We were under consent decree to fix the problem and paid fees because we ignored deadlines. Many questions were asked by the Gadflies and others for a long period of time in a variety forums. Finally, the Town came up with a plan, brought it to a professionally run public forum, answered questions and passed a plan. Reasonable people believe that the questions were instrumental in bringing about the solution. In any case, the solution has timelines, goals, objectives and a clear budget. this question, for now, has been answered. For that reason, the question is no longer asked.
The take away here is that questions are useful and when they are answered, it is unlikely that they will be asked again.
Questions got the stipends stopped as well. The ONLY thing that has produced positive change in East Greenbush is citizen activism. Nothing else. The examples abound and the political people in power don't matter.
DeleteTo repeat...the ONLY thing in East Greenbush that has produced positive change is citizen activism. That's the simple truth and the reality.
Dear Gadfly,
DeleteQuestions prevented Supervisor Langley's proposed salary increase from taking effect as well.
Be well,
Tom
10:17 implies a causality
ReplyDeleteit is more likely DEC's refusal to grant another consent order was the moving force behind the new treatment plant
Perhaps the publicity had something to do with DEC refusing to grant another consent order. There is certain causality in the publicity around the failure to address the problem and the new majority on the Town board.
DeleteAnyway, nobody asks questions after they have reasonably answered in public
DeleteIt is the right and the duty of every American to question their elected officials. That principle is the very foundation of our democracy.
ReplyDeleteEnough of the civics lesson.
People like Langley don't like questions because they prefer to keep citizens in the dark? Why? The answer covers a range:
1.) He thinks poorly on his feet.
2.) He is more than a little lazy and does not do his homework.
3.) He is not a good public speaker.
4.) He is usually not well prepared.
5.) He just not know the answer.
6.) He knows the answer but prefers to keep it to himself.
7.) Who knows why else?
People who are doing a good job are proud of their achievements and comfortable being asked questions. It really is no more complicated than that. Langley has almost nothing to be really proud of. So, the people who do ask questions get ridiculed. That's an old tactic designed to make you pause before you ask another question.
But, the good people of East Greenbush know all too well that asking questions and holding people in elected office accountable is the only shot they have in trying to make sure their tax dollars are not worse miss spent than they already are.
Langley has complete control over the process of sharing information with the public. Keep asking the questions folks. The fact that he, DeFruscio and Gilbert don't like the questions is the biggest clue that the questions are good questions and need to be asked.
No answer when you call Town Hall. That must be the way we will be notified that there is no pre Board meeting. I would have appreciated a message on the town web site or maybe even a message on the town phone answering system.
ReplyDeleteDear 3:27 PM
DeleteAfter some searching, I found the cancellation of the pre-board meeting message on the Town website. It was buried beneath Supervisor Langley's desk's January Happy New Year message.
Priorities, Mr. Langley, priorities??
Gotta say this folks.....Mr. Langley has been taking some shots recently, but he doesn't have to. There are plenty of folks available who could handle the public face of his administration. All he has to do is engage them. I personally believe that Mr. Langley wants to reform Town government. I believe that he's been getting questionable advice on how to do that. Plenty of support out there Keith and Mary Ann and Deb. All you have to do is welcome it.
ReplyDeleteDear Gadfly,
DeleteI hope you are right. But, I'll begin to believe it when Supervisor Langley takes advantage of the Gadfly's "This Space Available" offer.
I gotta disagree with Gadfly on this one ... the Supervisor's the top dog of Town government and should be the 'public face of his administration'.
DeleteI don't think the townspeople want to or deserve to hear from any second stringer, no offense to the other Board Members or the Department Heads.
Our friends at DEMands are fond of definitions.
su·per·vise : transitive verb \ˈsü-pər-ˌvīz\ : to be in charge of (someone or something) : to watch and direct (someone or something)
There's something of an irony here. The boys and girls at Talks have their shorts in a knot because the Supervisor designated himself as liaison to almost all the major departments. Just can't win, I guess.
DeleteI see nothing wrong with having a "flack" to take care of communications if you need one. Probably wouldn't hurt to have someone with communication skills to frame and convey stuff to the public. Let the Dep Supe carry that water, now that DEMands is down.
Dear Gadfly:
DeleteNot a bad idea. The "flack" could also be responsible for the processing and timely response to Freedom of Information Requests, submitted by interested groups and individuals to the various Town Departments and Boards.
Be well,
Tom
All they have to do is ask for help, and I believe some people will help them
DeleteGadfly @ 10:41
Deletefrom Talks post
Town Law §52 states “The supervisor shall be the chief executive officer of a suburban town and head of the administrative branch of town government. He shall be responsible for the proper administration of town affairs, law enforcement and the maintenance of peace and order in the town.”
Good Lord, he's paid $70,000 a year to be responsible for the ENTIRE Town not just select departments he chooses to be liaison to.
What is so hard to understand about this issue?
Why .
Why be so dense about reality
I want to commend the EG DPW and the County for the amazing job they have done handling this storm. The roads are in good shape with, of course, some spots where you need to be careful.
ReplyDeleteThese employees work a lot of hours, even when tired, to make sure the roads are safe for us all. I know, I also work for the town, but I am not involved with snow removal. Some people complain about services, but try doing what these guys do and you will see it's not easy nor fun.,
Good job!
I agree Joe! Great job guys. Wish my driveway looked half as good as the roads. Nice to see a complement on the blog instead of all the griping.
ReplyDeleteJoe we should all be thankful for the job the DPW crews do
ReplyDeleteToday I saw our crews out cutting down those huge snow banks along 9 & 20. That is a job well done. The banks would be very dangerous if it were not for this effort. To be fair, I noticed and appreciated this effort last year as well. Seems to me that the union employees do a great job on the wintery roads no matter who the elected officials are.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 12:11: You make an important point about the DPW guys doing a great job regardless of who sits on the town board. People bring a certain level of professionalism to what they do and that comes from within, not from the direction the political winds are blowing. Kudos to the crews for the way they handled this storm. This was a tough one.
ReplyDeleteRemember that the next time you get on one of your reduce property tax rants. You get what you pay for Jack. Sorry you can't pander both ways.
DeleteAnonymous 2:27: You could probably clear the Grand Canyon with that leap of logic. Saying DPW did a good job with the storm means I'm not in favor of cutting taxes? I believe we could retain every essential service in town at 80% of what it's costing us right now. With regular audits, use of generally accepted accounting principles, ending hiring and raises for insiders, restricting the cash cow of unnecessary overtime, consolidation of services, inventorying of town resources and some strategic planning there wouldn't be even a blip in the productivity graph and taxes could be radically reduced. You, on the other hand imply with your comment that every tax dollar has been spent efficiently providing essential services without a single misstep, faulty accounting, or jobs and payouts for insiders. Who's doing the pandering here?
DeleteAnd, by the way, when you say I can't pander 'both ways' do you mean I'm pandering to the two political factions that run this town? The way I see it I'm only pandering one way - to the beleaguered taxpayers of East Greenbush. I couldn't give a you know what about the two factions.
RIGHT ON THE MONEY, JACK CONWAY!!!!
DeleteJack; If my property taxes were to be reduced by 20%, how much would that reduce my total tax bill? I currently pay $ 3,646 per year in total taxes on my Clinton Heights home. Would the 20% come off of my total tax bill?
DeleteHI. this is 2:11 from yeserday. I would like to tell 2:27 above that I never rant, (I don't think Jack does either) but I do think there is room for tax cuts in conjunction with appreciating the work of the hard working employees. if we could see an audit, we would know where to save. Meanwhile, I will reserve the right to compliment folks at will.
ReplyDeletetalk about a leap
ReplyDeleteretain every essential service in town at 80% of what it's costing us right now.
now ya sound like dimartino and matters
That's not what he said, Anony. I think he said that there is about a 20% "slap gap" in the Town's budget made up of slushy cash to stuff that doesn't need to be bought or paid for. Like payments to unnecessary insiders.
DeleteDear Jack and The Gadfly:
ReplyDeleteZero-based budgeting, which was an effective campaign platform point during the recent Smart Way Forward campaign, might also provide the Town Board with a good data driven starting point to achieve a reduction in Town taxes.
Kudos to the DPW for their good work before, during and after our most recent nor'easter.
Be well,
Tom
Dear Tom Grant the elder;
DeleteCould you please explain what zero based budgeting is? I've never heard of such a term.
Dear Anony.... I think Tom and Mary Ann and I would just love to sit down with you (If you would identify yourself) and explain what zero based budgeting is. It's really very simple, so it won't take very long. Saves a lot of cash too. But it requires serious management effort.
DeleteDear 7:05 PM:
ReplyDeleteWikipedia provides a pretty good thumbnail explanation of the concept and advantages/disadvantages of "Zero-based" budgeting in the public sector. I commend it to your attention.
All the best,
Tom
Zero based budgeting is a remarkably simple concept. Each line item of the budget is analyzed, calculated and justified based on empirical data, facts and history.
ReplyDeleteNon zero based budgeting takes last year's numbers and bumps them up by some made up factor.
Zero based budgeting is for professional managers of other people's money. Non zero based budgeting is for people who are a little lazy and do not care that much about how other people's money is managed and spent. How's that for an explanation?
Zero based budgeting is a very common term - Goggle it.
I agree with Jack 100% when he said "people bring a certain level of professionalism to what they do and that comes from within, not from the direction the political winds are blowing." A work ethic is something that is developed from the day we're born to the first day of school and then the first day of a new job and it usually, but not always, stems from the example adults, mostly our parents, set around us when we were growing up. My parents, especially my father, always had a strong work ethic and he expected nothing less from his kids, especially when we grew up and went to work. No matter who my boss is today, I always insist on doing a good job and earning my wages because that's how I was raised. It's clear to me that after the last storm, the DPW has dedicated workers who also want to do a good job and earn their wages. Leaping to "Sorry, Jack, you can't pander both ways" was just taking the nice compliment Jack was paying to the workers and politicizing it, which was nothing but unfortunate.
ReplyDeleteRick Matters was the first one to utter the words "zero-based budgeting" in our town. Just wanted to give credit where credit is due.
ReplyDeleteHere's hoping Mary Ann Matters and her SWF Majority is successful in implementing Zero Based Budgeting (ZBB) practices for our Town. While Rick Matters may have uttered the words, I'm hoping Mary Ann Matters is able to actually accomplish something.
DeleteHowever, it will be impossible to accomplish this without the determined leadership of our Town Supervisor and Chief Financial Officer, Keith Langley.
Good luck with that, Councilperson Matters. We are rooting for you.
Why, oh why does it always seem to come down to Keith Langley? Based on his performance as Supervisor over the last two plus years, Mr. Langley seems remarkably timid and hesitant to try to do anything that even resembles reform and positive change. It's too bad he continues to follow the lead of Mr. DeFruscio, instead of Ms. Matters.
DeleteAnon 2/17 at 4:04 a.m. - I think you nailed it. Excellent.
ReplyDeleteAnon 2/17 at 10:27 a.m. The words "determined leadership of our Town Supr/CFO" followed by "good luck with that" are nothing short of chilling. It's impossible to know if you are being sarcastic or sincere. That's the chilling part.
ReplyDelete@11:59 AM- Time will tell. It's all up to Keith Langley.
DeleteJust a response to zero Base , not a bad idea but the time it would take to use this method would slow down all other duties the department head is responsible for.Why not use a standard budget and be done with it . Now if there is a surplus you can pass this on to the tax payer in the following year , beside each head should have an idea what the cost is to run his or her dept. Not to put down mr. Matters but time well spent should be running there dept. . Running town hall ! should be done by the all board members not by an out side source or influence , we as tax payers need not interfere with day to day operations this is why we have a staff of people and a board , myself would like to see the staff and board left alone so they can do the things we elected them to do . Ethics ! we have a code why should we ask the board to go back wards , these people have enough on there plate , water treatment , miss managed tax payers dollars , training new people , and correcting past problems in all dept. , Union contracts, last but not least we have a new board majority trying to get acclimated . Just my opinion as a new old blogger , I could never figure out why so many people had such strong opinions about how things should be done in town hall , then never show up before during or after board meetings .Did not go well ! At least Cristo Taylor made a run for it . To the rest , let the players play , then VOTE them in or out . Thank you !
ReplyDeleteTo 3:49pm, The reason people are focused and are optimistic about the enactment of Zero-Based budgeting principles and the establishment of a strong Ethics Code is that Mary Ann Matters and Deb DiMartino ran on those issues during their successful Smart Way Forward Campaign. Many of us are counting on them to follow through with their campaign promises. The concern some of us have is whether or not Supervisor Langley (Chris DeFruscio) will allow Mary Ann and Deb to enact their reform agenda.
DeleteI'd just add, DK, that if it were not for the active attention of concerned citizens, it is highly likely that a good deal of the mischief and mismanagement you refer to would still be going on.
DeleteIs DK actually KL? Sure has a similar writing style. If so, glad to see you're still reading the Gadfly blog.
DeleteThe following text from DK above is a bit worrysome:
Delete"Just a response to zero Base , not a bad idea but the time it would take to use this method would slow down all other duties the department head is responsible for.Why not use a standard budget and be done with it . Now if there is a surplus you can pass this on to the tax payer in the following year , beside each head should have an idea what the cost is to run his or her dept."
It appears to me that DK is arguing that it is just too bothersome for a department head to do a workload analysis for his/her area of responsibility and that what it takes to operate a particular service is somehow derived from some sort of instinct or perhaps a beatific vision of sorts.
Tell us, DK, where does a department head get the "idea" of what it costs to run his/her department? And how do you know that the number is "real" and defensible?
Back to the latest snow storm,Why is it that surrounding communities have all their sidewalks cleared ??? Most of which where done by Friday afternoon! Why the hell does it take so long for E.G. to clear the sidewalks or even clear the huge snowbanks at the intersections along 9&20,Rte 4.etc.Where is all that professionalism and strong work ethic???
ReplyDeleteThis town is the biggest joke on this side of the river.Many people use these sidewalks every day ,just look at the people walking in the road...REAL SAFE...NOT!!!
The state installed these sidewalks with the stipulation that the town take care of them.Is this the same way we handled the sewer treatment plant...just ignore it and it will go away???
Yes,the snow will melt come April or May,But how long will it take before someone gets hurt or even killed trying to cross or walk the road???
By the way the snowplows didn't come past my house until 8:35 am friday after over a foot of snow overnight....they didn't need new tires Anthony They needed chains on the tires.
I'll bet Corillis Drive was cleared a hell of alot eariler than that.
P.S. Why the hell is this service station on the corner of Old Troy Rd.&9&20 allowed to plow his snow into the intersection time and time again.
Anony 2/17 @ 4:12 p.m: For Keith Langley and Chris DeFruscio, the SWF was to pick two inexperienced candidates with enough personal appeal to get elected, which is exactly what happened. That way, they figured they could run the show and the "girls" would have no choice but to support their vision for the town. Therefore, the concern that Deb and MA will not be allowed to enact their reform agenda is very valid. We are already seeing ethics reform on the back burner. Deb and MA said the SWF "team," including Supr Langley, would enact changes to it in January, which didn't happen. Deb and MA also campaigned on governmental openness and transparency, which, so far, isn't happening either. Until Deb and MA realize their power on the board, there isn't much hope for positive change in East Greenbush. Let's just hope they are fast learners.
ReplyDeleteThe thing is.....If DeF/Langley is nothing but warmed over Maney/Malone, they're not long for power. The Town's had enough. I do have a feeling that DeF really wants to be a Maney/Malone, but it ain't gonna happen. They're "users."
DeleteDiMartino and Matters ran on zero based budgeting in addition to other good sounding campaign promises
Deleteif Langley wanted to embrace these concepts he'd have used ZBB in preparing his 2014 budget
instead he looked like a deer in the headlights when Mangold offered to adopt his zero tax increase budget
Yes, and it's no fun feeling used. Luckily, they're not stuck. That's why it's a five person board, not a one person board, and why each board member's vote is equally weighted. The sooner the Supr realizes this, and respects and appreciates it, the better off he'll be. So far, he doesn't get it.
ReplyDeleteTo gadfly @ 5:41-- Speaking of mischief, what ever happened to recouping the money that the receiver of taxes and the previous Supervisor owes back to the town. As I recall it was a substantial amount of money. Shouldn't the new board members make this a priority and try to collect the overpaid money?
ReplyDeleteAbout once a month someone posts the odd concept of asking citizens to stop participating in their government as requested in the post from DK, above. Each time I have responded pointing out the flaw in that thinking often making note of the US Constitution "of the people, by the people, and for the people". I stand ready to support the Constitution by posting here and participating in other peaceful forums.
ReplyDeleteThis particular post from DK has some curious language about "letting the players play". Who are the players? WE, THE PEOPLE, THATS WHO! And the hard work of governing is far from play.
I find it hard to believe that Matters and DiMartio didn't understand that it was not in the Langley plan to allow them to govern. He just wanted what they handed over to him during the campaign: their unquestioning obedience. They certainly have the option of stepping away from Keith's silly, cloak and dagger government and I would encourage them to do so. If they become independent it will be good for the town and good for them. Be true to yourselves, SWF.
See you all tomorrow night.
DK---question for you, please explain what you mean by, "At least Cristo Taylor made a run for it ."
ReplyDelete10:38 I agree, but no offense intended, "of the people, by the people, and for the people" is from Lincoln's Gettysburg Address and not the Constitution,
ReplyDeleteOoops. Thank you for pointing that out.
DeleteWell, the meeting is tonight and still no agenda. So much for that SWF campaign promise
ReplyDeleteFeb 19 @6:52--True but The Constitution does begin with "We the People". From there it states, "...of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."
ReplyDeleteSo it does seem the "the people" were included in the "general welfare".
There is also the bill of Rights. The first Amendment stating, "Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances." The Town Gov't and its leaders should NOT prohibit the expression of opinions or the right of the citizens to peaceable assembly, and should actually LISTEN to those that have grievances.
The Constitution and the Bill of Rights provide the citizens the freedom and right to BLOG, critique, especially when those serving the citizens have not been honest and/or do not keep their promises, discuss and share grievances AND state those grievances to their representatives. Rather than "hushing the crowd", as they do in RUSSIA, maybe the majority should LISTEN to the crowd, even if the crowd disagrees with them.