I think we need to see a policy commitment from the new
administration. This would mean some
statements as to goals to be achieved.
This would also mean some statements as to how the current budget works
to move toward those goals. This would
also mean some statements as to how the Organizational Meeting decisions
further the stated goals.
I think a lot of us would give almost anything for
leadership which could articulate a vision for the Town and the steps to be
taken to get to the goal. Simply state
what you are trying to achieve in quantifiable terms and then state the steps
you are taking to achieve those goals.
This is not rocket science.
Governments do it every day. If
you can’t measure it, you can’t manage it.
Keith, Mary Ann, Deb, Ed…..Write something up related to the
goals of the new administration and the steps already taken and to be taken to
achieve those goals and post them here.
Let the community know what’s on the agenda. That's transparency. Right now, folks are taking shots at what they see in the personnel charts. Are you going to recind the tax increase? Was the "tap-dance" on the budget an exercise to get cash for new pork for your use? The election announcement was that there was a "tax cut." The moves at the last Board meeting made sure that there wasn't one. Who's ideas was that?? You see that some decisions keep raising questions.
So write something. Fly the policy flag of the new administration. Post it here.
Dear Gadfly,
ReplyDeleteI'm looking forward to the unveiling of the Smart Way Forward's Zero Base Budget Plan now that Supervisor Langley has his appointees in place.
They can not rescind the tax increase.
ReplyDeleteI'm glad VanWormer's still here to lead DPW through today's storm ... at least until around 6:30PM!
Dear Gadfly:
ReplyDeleteHere's another suggestion for the new majority:
1.) Charge the new Citizens Fiscal Advisory Committee to analyze the town's fiscal condition, analyze the financial impact of the changes coming with tonight's Organizational Meeting and lastly, have the CFAC study the long term effects of the various collective bargaining agreements in terms of health care cost and future pension fund liabilities for taxpayers.
2.) Create a citizens committee to recommend a vision and set of goals. I'll bet every East Greenbush resident working in the private sector has to create goals and almost major company has a vision statement. Engage volunteers to put both together for their peers - meaning all the taxpayers of the town.
Personally, of all the wonderful things you have posted on this blog I think this is the best. The new majority should do exactly what you are suggesting. I'll bet a lot they never will but it would be so darn energizing with they would.
Thanks, fantastic post.
So is this what it boils down to.....Chris DeF packing a gun in Town Hall? Is this what he is about? The Town Board had better wake up sometime soon. Bruen out of control and the Chair too?????
ReplyDeleteIt is now painfully obvious that the only thing that will rescue the taxpayers of East Greenbush from one set of political hacks followed by another set of political hacks is a third party revolution and takeover of town government.
ReplyDeleteThe most recently posting over on the Talks blog is one I, very unfortunately, agree with.
But I also find everything being said on Talks the absolute triumph of hypocrisy versus common sense and common decency. You being critical of the new majority for doing EXACTLY what you did ! Joan Malone (Phil's mother) and Mike O'Brien (Ginny's husband) ? Come on. Get real. Ginny and Phil and Sue Mangold has other friends and relatives in town jobs. So, get real.
The Talks majority of Mangold, O'Brien and Malone blocked the ethics for more than two years. When they finally passed it as a failed campaign tactic they removed the nepotism language. Why? To protect their very own nepotism appointment of course. Hypocrits? You bet.
But the new majority is off to a terrible start - I completely share that sentiment. Langley is a terrible leader and an even worse manager. Terrible. He is every bit as disengenuous ( = Lies) and corwardly as the previous supervisor. Same goes for O'Brien, Mangold and Malone versus DiMartino and Matters.
So, like Talks said - we'll all be watching. Results count in the end because we should never expect too much from politcal hacks. We've learned that sad lesson.
If the town is run better (No evidence of that so far) and if taxes go down dramatically the new majority can be forgiven for their early bad start. We will, indeed, all be watching.
Jan 3 at 3:50 a.m. - this is your harsher than harsh opinion of the new majority only three days into the new year? Unreasonable. Give them three months or even three years to fix the MESS the DEMS made of the town. we'll listen.
ReplyDeleteI find three months unreasonable. They've had 6 weeks to make the decisions that were made last night and it is painfully obvious that NOTHING has changed ! The patronage / nepotism / cronyism are worse than before. The needless pay increases and greasing of pockets is completely contradictory to what their campaign promises said.
DeleteWait - for what ? Defruscio to appoint more of his family and friends to cushy town jobs ? You'll listen ?? To who - you've openly ignored the voters wishes.
@ 7:01 - What is unreasonable is the Right Way Forward going to their first meeting and acting contrary to all the pretended to stand for during the campaign. Many readers here (not me) bought the "give Keith the majority" ruse and are sorry now. This Supervisor has had his time and the honeymoon is over. He treated people poorly ever since he was elected and he tried to become DEM! They would not have him. Neither should the reformers. Let him be the sole possession of the Republicans and their families.
DeleteI have heard enough. Smart Way Forward betrayed the voters right out of the gate they deserve to be under the microscope on all that they do.
Don; As I see it you have an opportunity here. You might want to wipe the steam off your mirror, look yourself straight in the face and ask yourself. Is it time to change my approach and work with this new Board Majority or continue down my current path.
ReplyDeleteLangley has accomplished what he has because he understands the value of team work. Something to think about.
Sincerely yours,
A Team Player
Dear Team Player....Here's your chance. If you look at the beginning of this thread, I asked for a Vision Statement and a concrete statement of plans. So stop with the generalities. Make a list of what Langley has accomplished and a list of concrete goals which are to be accomplished....with the concrete steps to be taken to get there. I'll post them. We were promised zero-based budgeting, but got a tap-dance at the Board meeting which led to a tax increase. Didn't have to happen, but did because Langley and Matters weren't prepared. Mangold wanted language which they weren't prepared for, and we all got the bill.
DeleteThe roll-out last night was a disaster. You've got NOBODY capable of homework and preparation.
Nice post. I believe Langley and Matters were caught off-guard by Mangold's offer to support their budget ... couldn't process the offer as it was 'off script'
ReplyDeleteDid I read it right that Deputy Supervisor Edward Gilbert is now being paid $3,000 a year from Taxpayer Dollars to serve as Keith Langley's paid companion? I thought Mr. Gilbert was a reformer only interested in saving the taxpayers' money and open and transparent government?
ReplyDeleteLooks like he's become just another DeFruscio political hack with his hand out.
I am very disappointed in Mr. Gilbert. He used to be a voice of reason for the people.
I agree that the new appointments raise a number of questions but I also agree with Anonymous 7:01 that it's too early to tell if the new people are up to their assignments. I urge someone on the inside to accept Gadfly's invitation and provide an overview of where they're going and how the new appointments serve those purposes. I would like to see a formal analysis of the budget and tax implications of what happened at the organizational meeting. A number of good people lost their jobs so it's understandable that confusion and hard feelings permeate public comment right now but since both sides play insider politics all the time, the real question is whether the new appointments are capable and qualified. It will take time to know. But if this is the change we were promised and the 'smart way forward' then someone should respond to the Gadfly and show us how this is supposed to work.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure they 'saved' money 'thanks' to the seven eliminated positions but what are the hidden costs?
DeleteLangley and DeFrusci dealt the cards for the appointments and, http://www.eastgreenbushtalks.blogspot.com/, has some VERY valid points. One thing this Town does NOT need are hypocrites holding elected positions (Langley)! The madness and "trough" mentality need to end and apparently Langley and Defrusci do not have the ethical make-up in their fiber to do this.
ReplyDeleteJim C--AGREED! The way VanWormer obtained his job is the same way he lost his job. This does not make it right. If Van Wormer was doing a good job, and by accounts he was (we could use him during this storm!) than Langley and Defrusci should not have played politics with the position. That position is ALWAYS played with for politics and that position is too important to play with. VanWormer--you may want to consider Jim C's suggestion and contact a Gadfly.
Jack Conway--AGREED! It is early but, the appointments seem questionable and "Talks" has understandable questions and concerns. They were accused of the same behavior Langley and Defrusci are exhibiting--shame on Langley and Defrusci!!!!
Langley and Defrusci needs to knock it off with the "quid pro quo'!
Langley---in 2 years people will be reminded of what you and Defrusci did and do. Many of us will have no problem writing to The Advertiser, with our name, and on this blog, with our name, when the time comes and voters need to be reminded of your antics. Some of us may not have any problem running a primary against you for the Cons and Indy Lines as well as the Working Family--which would be 3 lines buddy! Ask McCabe--it only takes a few of us to drip the facts onto the public......
Anon Jan 3 @ 3:50 am--AMEN to that!
ReplyDeleteMy problem is the people who were replaced found out on the Town Website. That is just wrong they could of sent a letter or something. I'm one of those people who gained a job and then lost it I understand that's politics . But to find out that way is just wrong. Nanci Hicks
ReplyDeleteThe old set of fools are replaced by new ones. And now the old ones are reading the riot act. How dare these new charlatans act like them, the true & rightful charlatans! I'd laugh my ass off if it weren't so painful to my wallet. Those old fools screwed this town so badly - all to their own enrichment - and now we're supposed to give two sh*** about how they feel? Please, everyone, keep our eyes squarely set on these new ones - watch them like a hawk. Publicize every little thing that furthers the Town's financial & cultural demise. Throw them out if they completely screw us like the prior crowd and pray a Third Alternative arises.
ReplyDeleteNanci Hicks--You are spot on! It is plain wrong!
ReplyDeleteAnon Jan 3@12:48PM--Exactly! Hypocrites! Langley and Defrusci are hypocrites! This all needs to be remembered and recalled in 2 years when Langley seeks re-election. Your prayer of a a Third Alternative may very well be answered because Langley and Defrusci need to be taught a lesson and some people have no problem being the ones to take them to school.
NOBODY ever elected Defrusci and Langley has done nothing but whine and complain for the past 2 years and NOW they want their wish list rubber stamped! WRONG! And telling people they are terminated via a website--WHAT IS WRONG WITH THOSE PEOPLE!
The voters hoped for change and got a wolf in sheep's clothing!
Langley should understand the Reformers began because of the same things he is doing now. When the Dems were practicing nepotism/cronyism the Reformers cried foul and now it is your turn Langley--FOUL! Not only is it a foul BUT it is also hypocritical. My gosh--2 jobs to the same person and multiple jobs to the same family???? Who is checking whom????? No way there is any form of checks and balances for policies when individuals within the same families are working together. And why??? Why has Town Hall become a family business???? The Dems made it a family business, Repubs cried and whined about nepotism then the Repubs hit a home run and became the majority and now THEY are making Town Hall the family business.
ReplyDeleteThe Reformers are against nepotism/cronyism from BOTH parties. Town Hall is not a family business.
And Chris Defrusci getting a job? Holy Moses smell the roses! That is absurd and disgusting.
Langley is such a paranoid, power hungry supervisor. If he sat and actually thought, void of paranoia, he would see how destructive his decisions and actions are and in the end, his paranoia will be his downfall; the paranoia and the direction of Defrusci.
So Langley's offered a poem for the December Supervisor's report. How's this for a response?
ReplyDeleteThe eyes of Greenbush are upon you
All the live long days
The eyes of Greenbush are upon you
And you cannot get away
Do not think you can escape them
From night till early in the morn
The eyes of Greenbush are upon you
Till Gabriel blows his horn
The Bruen subject was brought up under the other heading, the heading of Thank YouRick Matters but I'm going to post this here.
ReplyDeleteSo last night (Jan 2) my mother who lives in town needed an ambulance (she lives in town) dialed 911 and low and behold an ambulance showed up, but without a paramedic, why because the medic was in Castleton taking a call that should have been taken care of by a commercial ambulance, not by Bruen.
So in case you people don't realize this could have been your mother, father,son daughter, or whatever, and this town is sending East Greenbush's medic to Castleton. We the tax payers here in EG pay for this service and yet they send it to Castleton.
This is what those medics went to town hall in November fighting against and now 4 of them are losing their jobs because of that. You see the medics wanted to keep their services in the town of EG, as they should be because we are paying for the best and should be getting the best.
The Bruen rescue Squad is breaking their contract with the town by not supplying the best possible service there is out there, and sending the towns medics to Castleton.
Lets get some things straight a Paramedic is an EMT just and advanced one
Paramedic = ALS = Advanced Life Support
EMT = BLS = Basic Life Support
The difference between what a medic and what an EMT can do are enormous. The only thing an EMT can do for a person with difficulty breathing is give them oxygen. A medic on the other hand can give them a nebulizer if need be, or even intubate a person that needs it. You see that is what was wrong with my mother difficulty breathing.
If you people in the town don't mind it the way it is do and say nothing, but someday when you need a medic and he/she just happens to be in Castleton don't come crying to me, you have been warned.
BTW thanks Anthony for being there.
Former EMT
Former Chief
Former Asst. Chief
Former Vice President......
Of Bruen Rescue Squad
Thanks Jim, you make some great points. There are some financial aspects that desperately need to be addressed as well, such as Bruen's 41% tax hike last year. No explanation. Hopefully the new Bruen liaison will make some headway and bring Bruen leadership into the light or cut them loose after years of secrecy and thumbing their noses at anyone seeking to regulate them, as required and as documented by the State Comptroller's office. The Ambulance District has other options besides Bruen, and the Town has work to do to make sure that what happened to your mother last night doesn't happen to anyone else. Let Castleton raise their Ambulance taxes 41% and hire some medics so we can keep ours here where they belong. Dwight Jenkins
DeleteDear Anonymous 3:58 PM:
ReplyDeleteNot bad, but I like Keith's poetry better. Why don't you stop by to see him at Town Hall. Maybe you can pick up a few pointers from him.
Please read Dwight's commentary on the Organizational Meeting here:
ReplyDeletehttp://eastgreenbushdreams.wordpress.com/2014/01/03/the-sadness-of-victory/
Nice post ... I believe Councilperson Mangold announced had previously announced that she would not be available for the Organizational Meeting.
DeleteWell there Mr. Gadfly since you insist on not being fair and balanced East Greenbush DEMands will be coming to life. Your ratings are about to notice a significant decline.
ReplyDeleteDear Chris and Keith (and Mary Ann and Deb), as Cmon Man pointed out at 3:15, the Dems lost because Reformers discovered what they were up to and made it public. You didn't get elected on performance, or promise for that matter. The Dems lost because what they were up to got exposed to the light of day. And the Dems learned well, because they've already started to implement the methodology which did them in - on the Talks blog in a cursory and quick analysis of the Organizational Meeting agenda. They're just making public what you are up to. Doesn't look good, does it? You're toast unless you learn to do what's right. So far, not so good.
ReplyDeleteOh Lordy Swordy you just don't get it. Both sides are working together playing all you idiots. If you only knew.
DeleteWhat phil erup and Inside Info don't get is that both their camps are morally and intellectually bankrupt. That's why it's highly likely that a third political movement will emerge in the future. The old ways are done. It's a new century. And we're tired of paying for mischief.
ReplyDeleteDear Sword you have no idea what's involved in running or you wouldn't even think about a third party run. but go ahead I double dog dare ya
DeleteDear Sword:
ReplyDeleteThank you for the terrific post! I respectfully disagree with you on one point . During their campaign the new Smart Way Forward Langley Majority promised many things, including to:
"Put residents first" and
"Require the hiring of employees to be based on merit, not on friendships and family relationships."
That is why many people voted for them.
Supervisor Langley and Councilpersons Matters and DiMartino are off to a terrible start.
We will be watching closely.
Check out Dwight's next installment on the Organizational Meeting:
ReplyDeletehttp://eastgreenbushdreams.wordpress.com/2014/01/04/a-very-gloomy-business/
Would anyone have any information regarding the status of the Labor negotiations?
ReplyDeleteSince I totally doubt Chris DeFruscio will post this on his EG DEMands blog I am going to ask the Gadfly to post it here.
ReplyDeleteDear Chris:
I am a registered independent and I supported reform for a number of years.
Be honest. You filled former political hack jobs with your political hacks. Stop pretending otherwise.
Be honest. DPW crews hid and slept every bit as much when you were DPW Commissioner.
Be honest. Dave Van Wormer did a pretty decent job. He was recognized for that on a non partisan basis. Is Dave a politician who supported his party? Sure. But be honest. So did your family and friends and political cronies.
Be honest. You wrote a fraudulent letter in the campaign two years ago - and got caught at it.
Be honest. Maybe then we'll believe you. Until then you are just another political hack.
The difference is Dave Vanwormer had the support of his Democrat board majority. He could have stopped his men from hiding and sleeping but didn't. At least tell all the truth here.
DeleteDear DeF at 3:21.... With regard to the election in two years.....The Dems have disgraced themselves. I don't think we'll want to be trying them out again for a while. In two years, the Supe's seat and Malone's and Mangold's come up for election. So a majority is up for grabs. If you and Langley (and Mary Ann and Deb) don't show different "colors" and "values" than the Dems did for a number of years, you are vulnerable. Since we'll not want the Dems back, it's likely that the Supe's job and the Malone/Mangold seats could go to folks who understand what reform is about. Just keep remembering, you won because the Dems were discredited. If you don't perform....and do the same as the Dems...the same fate will be yours. Folks in Town are not going to put up with the same old same old with a different label. As I see it, you've got one and a half years to cut taxes and cut the patronage/nepotism/cronyism crap. Folks have learned how to watch.
ReplyDeleteYou know, I WAS done with all this, moving on with my life, but I have to respond. I told you they would start disparaging me, but I didn't realize they would resurrect Demands to do it. Let me tell you about a meeting I had on Thursday, hours before the organizational meeting. At about 1030am, Rich Benko and I were asked to go to the Supervisors office, which we did. First off, Ercole was there and let he let it be known that he was running this whole thing. By the whole thong, I mean the town and its hiring and firing. It was surreal! The man is absolutely coo coo for Cocoa Puffs. He and the empty suit behind the desk then went on to tell me and Rich that they were trying to save our jobs. I told them straight up, no matter what they did with me, do not lay off the 4 guys, it would be bad for the Town, we need the men....which is very true and bad for 4 families.They are down 7 guys since 2010. Also, just an FYI, it is total nonsense that the guys were hiding and sleeping. If this were true, don"t you think there would have been a picture or something? Or at least reported to someone?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, they said they had to lay off the 4 guys so they could hire Dan Fiacco. They were going to ruin 4 guys lives and put the taxpayers at risk, to hire Dan, who is a friend of mine. I have nothing bad to say about Dan Fiacco. They were getting serious pressure from the county....yet Ercole was running the whole thing. Rich and I were then pressured to join the Republican party committee, which we both told them NO. After much wrangling about that, plus alot more, the supervisor blurted out that he was not laying off the 4 guys. Also, they were going to pull the resolution to appoint Corellis and Fiacco. Rich and I were going to stay on as holdovers, indefinitely. Apparently, he had an epiphany and realized what the right thing to do was. After the 2hr long meeting, everybody left shaking hands and pretty happy. The supe even laughed at how it was going to be awkward with Mrs. Corellis as his secretary. I even called my wife and told her the great news. The next call was to my kids, who were home on a snow day, since dad losing his job was pretty upsetting. Everything was great, till Mr. all about the family Langley called me at about 3:00 and told me they were moving forward with the Corellis and Fiacco appointments, but were only going to lay off 2 guys. I said "you're kidding", and was told the board wanted to do it and he tried to save me. I thanked him for at least calling me this time and proceeded to go home and inform the 3 ladies at home.
So to sum it all up, these are cruel, cruel people we are dealing with. From finding out via the town website that I was being let go, to that dog and pony show on Thursday, they are incompetent. Keith Langley is not half the man he was when he entered office. I believe he started out his term wanting to do right, but buckled to the pressure of DeFruscio. I believe he was going to do the right thing on Thursday, but again buckled to DeFruscio pressure. This was the guys who wasn't going to govern like a politician, he was just gonna do what was right. What happened to that guy Keith? I'd love to know how your family feels about what you've become....I know how mine feels. You blamed Matters and DiMartino, but you have the deciding vote. Sleep well. Oh yeah, Ercole.......get help, you need it..
Dave....I posted this because you get equal access, but gimme a break about running a tight ship.
ReplyDeleteOkay, so here's a "tight ship" actual observation (no photos or video). BUT...keep in mind these observations covered BOTH the DeFruscio and Van Wormer times as DPW commish. I hope this ends the "who ran a tight ship" debate - because neither did.
ReplyDeleteThere is a crew that services town park. They do a generally excellent job. In the summer they empty the garbage cans on Saturday and Sunday - whether those cans need to be emptied or not. Sometimes this crew is two guys; sometimes it is three guys. I assume because they are working on Saturday and Sunday they are being paid overtime. The DPW guys, by the way, all make around $18 to $20 or so (and more) an hour on straight time last time anyone checked.
These garbage can emptying jobs can take HOURS. Done normally I would estimate the work, for two or three guys, is a matter of 15 to 30 minutes max. But people using town park have observed (me included) these guys spending 2 1/2 to 3 hours doing a few minutes worth of work that maybe does not even need to be done.
These guys mostly sit in the DPW truck. I have never seen them sleeping. Never. But they are also darn sure not working either - and all the time, I assume, on overtime.
Phil Malone's brother, by the way, is almost always one of the Saturday and Sunday overtime for only a little work guys.
There is not, in my opinion, a DPW Commissioner alive who is going to confront a sitting town board member's brother. That is why nepotism is a terrible thing.
Personally, I think Van Wormer was HUGELY a better DPW Commissioner than DeFruscio. But neither set any productivity standards for the crews from these simple observations. But Van Wormer was HUGELY more responsive to taxpayers - including on weekends.
Pete Partak, by the way, was the DPW Commissioner before DeFruscio. Partak is the guy directly responsible for the "lost" fuel records and the wiped clean computer hard drive that former supervisor McCabe told me was a normal part of any administration change over. Baloney.
Dave Van Wormer was fired from his job as a Rennselaer cop for sleeping on the job and for using the town's computer for personal business. A bar he owned was ticketed for serving under age people.
Chris DeFruscio is the guy who wrote the fraudulent Martha letter in the previous campaign.
In the race to the bottom of the decency barrel I would call it a tie in East Greenbush between the democrats and the republicans. Neither political party can ever, ever claim the moral high ground. Both political parties, in my opinion, are bottom feeding, downright nasty seekers of taxpayer dollars for themselves, their family members and their political hacks.
For anyone from either the democratic or republican political party to claim honesty and decency in governing is, far and away, one of the greatest falsehoods ever perpetuated. There is no debate and no argument. None.
The deomocratic majority ran this town into the ground financially. No debate or argument there either. Every fact proves it. I had hope and faith in Matters and DiMartino. So far anyway, I feel betrayed.
Thank you Gadflies. You have been, and remain, the only hope for keeping these political thugs from both political parties somewhat in check.
Allow me to reply for Dave in words from some folks you’ll recognize:
ReplyDeleteAny ship could be more tightly run. But Dave definitely took his job seriously and, as can be inferred from EILEEN GRANT’s comment, worked for the residents of East Greenbush, not Supervisor McCabe or Supervisor Langley.
RAY MOONEY “A Fine Morning”
“Retain Dave Van Wormer as DPW Commissioner. He is the best, by far, of the last three people to hold that position. You will need Dave’s knowledge and support to reduce overtime and eliminate DPW excess positions. Use his expertise.”
RAY MOONEY November 16, 2013 at 12:45 PM
“So, I spoke highly of Dave Van Wormer. Do I like his politics? Probably not. But he is incontrovertibly the best of the last three DPW Commissioners. Please note: I never said Dave was perfect; just the best relative to the two previous commissioners.”
JACK CONWAY December 31, 2013 at 9:11 AM
“As someone who pays very close attention to what goes on in this town, I'm sorry to see Dave Van Wormer go. He did an excellent job as DPW commissioner.”
EILEEN GRANT December 31, 2013 at 10:00 AM
“How right you are, Jack. I had an opportunity to forward many citizen complaints to Dave during the seven months I worked at Town Hall. Each and every one was promptly resolved, often with a thank you from the constituent.”
RAY MOONEY December 31, 2013 at 5:01 PM
“In a previous open letter to Matter, DiMartino and Langley posted on this Gadfly blog I argued for your retention. That was based on performance not politics. Everything you said about your responsiveness is 100% factual and accurate.
Dave, I will always respect how supportive you were when it came to improving town park. Your crew was equally responsive after the storm took down all those trees. And you, personally, were wonderfully responsive when I had a drainage question. You were, head and shoulders, above the two previous DPW Commissioners - one of whom now has some dumb ass court attendant position he awarded himself.”
Well the Saturday night buzz has VanWormer and McCabe putting the band back together. Had a big pow wow at teagan's and Phil wasn't invited.
ReplyDeleteHow delightful!! Wasn't that configuration discredited and defeated? McCabe still looking for vindication, not good government.
DeleteHere's another reason that this Town's politics are in a race to the bottom. It's the last statement on the Talks post with the hogs. Talks about a disingenuous denial of the truth.
ReplyDelete" We're confident that resume's were solicited and will be shared with the Minority Town Board Members.
Keep your eyes on this crowd. We certainly will!"
I have been informed by Jack Conway that Phil Malone, Ginny O'Brien and Sue Mangold removed the language from the draft Ethics Code which would have required the solicitation of resumes.
I believe Jack may be mistaken ... the BOE's Code only required the solicitation of resumes through the official town newspaper prior to the appointment of a relative of a member of the town board.
ReplyDeleteFurthermore, the previous Majority filled the Town Comptroller and Purchasing Agent positions after soliciting resumes ... the postings are still on line under Comptroller downloads ... at least until the new Administration reads this comment.
No disingenuous denial of the truth.
Anonymous 4:31: I wasn't mistaken when I said the democratic majority took the soliciting of resumes out of the nepotism section of the Code of Ethics. For me that was a clear indication of a lack of transparency in the hiring of the closest category of political insider - family members. Much of what appeared on EG Talks about the organizational meeting had merit but for the democrats of East Greenbush to accuse someone of not soliciting resumes before hiring political insiders is sour grapes. Also, you forgot to mention that after soliciting resumes for the Comptroller position, the applicant with the most relevant qualifications was bypassed. Ironically, that person has now been hired. That too may qualify as 'disingenuous denial of the truth.'
ReplyDeleteJack Conway---Agree with you on all points, including the sour grapes on Talks. However, Talks may have sour grapes but they are correct to point out the hypocrisy of the new Administration. The R's cried foul every time the D's appointed family/friend to a position. The R's balked when Phil's Mom was appointed and Ginny's husband was appointed. The R's have cast the dye for their administration and they have now cemented themselves into the list of the most hypocritical group this Town has seen in some time. At least the D's are open about their appointments and as mush as I do not care for Phil Malone, he was blunt and open when he said something to the effect that the majority gets what they want. The R's---appointing Chris Defrusci is so wrong and so contradictory to what they claimed. Very disappointing and it offers little hope for an ethical vein in the new Administration.
ReplyDeleteIt is sad.
Dear Jack,
ReplyDeleteThe appointment of Chris DeFruscio, or any current political party leader, to a position in the Court System, is completely inappropriate and unethical. When families and individuals come into contact with the judicial system, they are generally experiencing very difficult and stressful times. As a result, appointments to court positions must be carefully vetted to ensure that they are removed from any appearance of participation in crass partisan politics. Chairman DeFruscio's appointment does not inspire confidence that the Courts in East Greenbush will be run in a non-partisan manner and will only lead to valid accusations of appearances of impropriety in the administration of justice.
It's also very disappointing that Keith Langley and the Smart Way Forward majority of Matters and DiMartino do not recognize that the appointment of a sitting political party chairman to a position in the court system is grossly inappropriate and will result in a loss of confidence in a local Justice Court that has recently had to deal with the inappropriate behavior of a now former sitting Justice.
To the two recent commentators: I wholeheartedly agree that insider politics is what got this town in trouble and recent events have shown that we now have a new set of insiders, not a new way of doing things. The manner in which the dismissals were handled didn't bring honor to the supervisor or new majority either. As to Chris' appointment, I just don't understand the reasoning behind it. It's a pittance of a salary and it sends the wrong message. I don't even know why Chris would want to do it, I proposed a provision in the Code of Ethics that would ban members of political committees from holding town jobs. Members could be appointed but would have to resign upon assuming their duties for the town. I still believe that is a good idea. Politicizing the court system beyond the electing of judges is always a bad idea.
ReplyDeleteJack, since Gadfly likely won’t post this,
ReplyDeletePerhaps Gadfly misquoted you. The only mention in the BOE Ethics Law Draft concerning resumes requires soliciting them prior to the appointment of a relative of a member of the town board. Gadfly missed this nuance.
Sound HR practice dictates resumes for all appointments, whether related to a Board Member or not.
ALL Boards Members should have access to the resumes of the appointees.
We wish Mr. Phillips the best of luck in his new position as Comptroller. His success is the Town’s success. However, he falls short on one critical qualification contained in nys public officers law, namely the residency requirement.
Although Gadfly may have missed the nuance of this, you may be thinking about this the wrong way. If there's any situation that should require soliciting of resumes it's when a relative of a town board member is hired. If the majority was against soliciting resumes in those cases it's a fair inference to conclude they had no interest in soliciting resumes in cases that were not as sensitive. You're absolutely right that sound HR practice dictate resumes for all appointments but it's pretty clear that sound HR practices have not been followed in town government, a reality that may have reached a new low if the stories about the dismissal of employees in the last week are true. You and I also agree that all board members should have access to the resumes of appointees but I would go even further: since these are people paid out of taxpayer funds their resumes should be on the town website as public information.
DeleteDear Jack,
ReplyDeleteAgreed! The Chris DeFruscio case is even worse. He is not JUST a member of the political party committee. He is the CHAIRMAN of the political party Committee. It is the Party Chairman's responsibility, according to the political Committee bylaws, to manage the Party's Political campaigns in the Town and to work for the election of ONLY Party designated candidates for political office. That is why the Rules of the Chief Judge of the Unified Court System clearly state that political party leaders are ineligible to serve as non-judicial court employees.
I wonder if Chris even bothered to submit a Resume for the Smart Way Forward Majority to review?
It's only a matter of time before the Unified Court System will be requesting information about Chairman DeFruscio's Party Affiliations.
Why would the Town- Langley, Matters and DiMartino- want to put itself in the position of being told by the Chief Judge of the Court System that the DeFruscio appointment is inappropriate?
ReplyDeleteIt doesn't seem to make a lot of sense.
What you allow is what will continue ! Defruscio needs to be put in his place - quickly !
DeleteLike somebody said about the Stipends some time back.....If you don't "nail" them, you license them.
DeleteFor the same reason that they appointed Corellis DPW Commissioner, violating the brand new ethics code. They don't know what they are doing. Or maybe, they do know what they are doing, but are so arrogant that they don't care about the laws. I think its both actually.
ReplyDeleteI don't quite understand. Would you mind quoting the Code? This would be a good educational exercise for all citizens.
DeleteOn a parallel note, didn't the Smart Way Forward promise to pass the original Ethics Code draft after elected?
As soon as the Town posts the enacted Code on its web site. It was only adopted in October. I guess good work takes time.
DeleteAside from salaries and pensions, the new majority may soon be provided with a tremendous opportunity to alleviate the crushing property tax burden in the town. If the State Legislature implements the Governor's tax reform proposals, East Greenbush residents can benefit from a two-year property tax freeze and offer a circuit breaker relief to seniors and others without sufficient income to meet the property tax increases. Of course, to qualify East Greenbush will not only have to stay within the 2% property tax cap, but also initiate local government consolidation and/or comprehensive shared services agreements with other local governments. Taking advantage of available tax-relief opportunities should be the next focus - let's hope the Board members are prepared to seek support from Sen. Marchione and Assemblyman McDonald to enact the Governor's tax relief proposals and then follow-through with cost containment and consolidation efforts to qualify East Greenbush for the 2-year property tax freeze and the circuit breaker!
ReplyDeleteExcerpts from the proposed Property Tax Relief Plan:
2-Year Freeze on Property Taxes
By almost any measure, New York’s real property taxes are the highest in the nation with an average residential bill of $5,040. In addition, three of the top four highest county median tax bills in the country are in New York. And New York is one of only 10 states where a resident can live in three general purpose local governments at the same time. There is no reason for New York to have nearly 10,500 separate forms of local governments; many of which provide overlapping or duplicative services.
Governor Cuomo’s proposal will freeze property taxes for two years, subject to two important conditions. In year one, the State will only provide tax rebates to homeowners who live in a jurisdiction that stays within the 2% property tax cap. In year two, the State will only provide tax rebates to homeowners who live in a locality that stays within the cap and also agrees to implement a shared services or administrative consolidation plan. Once fully implemented, this tax relief proposal will provide nearly $1 billion in relief with an average benefit of approximately $350 for nearly 2.8 million homeowners.
Property Tax “Circuit Breaker”
Under the property tax circuit breaker proposal, 1.9 million low- and middle-income taxpayers pay an effective real property tax rate relative to income that exceeds their income tax rate. To help these individuals and families, Governor Cuomo proposes that the State provide tax relief based on a taxpayer’s ability to pay. Households earning up to $200,000 would be eligible and the benefit would be administered as a refundable tax credit against the personal income tax with an average benefit of approximately $500. While the credit would be available statewide, in areas outside of New York City, only residents of jurisdictions that adhere to the property tax cap would qualify. This credit would be worth $1 billion in tax relief when fully phased in.
For folks who might be interested, I just sent Jim C. the text and the link to the fictitious comment attributed to him on the Demands blog. I'm sure he'll be responding here. Demands is turning out worse than Talks was at its birth. Perhaps Crist or Danaher or Cristo will tell the jerks to cool it.
ReplyDeleteTo the idiot or idiot's on the Demands blog, that find it funny to use my name. Maybe you should pay better attention to the way I do my name Jim_C, with an underscore, not Jim C without one.
ReplyDeleteToday is the first day I have been on your blog in well over 5 or 6 months, and the only reason I went there today is because someone informed me that I had a fan using my name.
I have better things to with myself than to worry who met with who, and quite honestly I don't really give a rats ass. I will take offense to a few of the names or kind of names you tried to use, I happen to be friends with a few of those people. If you have a problem with me being friends with them Too Bad!!!!
Just remember idiot I vote every year and so does everyone in my family and we can just as well vote the other way next time.
Jim_C- When I saw that post on EG DEMands purporting to be from you it made me wonder if we've finally reached the bottom of the cesspool. Besides being illiterate, it engaged in exactly the kind of personal backstabbing you've always refused to engage in. But after my initial outrage I got a little jealous. There must be another sub-literate ten year old who can pretend to be me, Didn't these guys just win an election? It may be hard to be a good loser but it shouldn't be that tough to show some class when you win.
DeleteJack: you are the epitome of class. I may not always agree with you, but you clearly and very specifically let us know exactly where you stand on any issue. Thank You ! Jim - my name was also on that list. I will talk with you about it later.
DeleteThanks Jack,
DeleteMy posts aren't always perfect either but most of the time I can formulate a sentence or two.
FYI,
ReplyDeleteStill no updated Financial Disclosure Forms filed with the NYS Board of Elections by the Chris Defruscio controlled East Greenbush Republican Committee.
Again, it's difficult to follow the money when a political chairman refuses to follow the law.
Jack---AGREED! When I read the Jim C comment, it was obvious Jim C was NOT the author.
ReplyDeleteWhat they are doing on egdemands.blogspot.com proves that a person cannot acquire class. Class is not a characteristic that can be learned or taught; a person either has it or they do not. If you recall, Talks exhibited much the same behavior when Mr. Malone won, to the point they physically attacked people at their election celebration on election night so apparently neither major party has a vein of class, humility and/or dignity among them. It is a pitiful assault on civility and decorum.
There is a certain degree of irony in the comments over on the anonymous Talks blog.
ReplyDeleteFirst it is really rather funny, in a tragic sort of way, to watch the new minority gripe about the EXACT things they did when they had the majority. Patronage? Nepotism? Have the Talks folks somehow missed Phil Malone's mother's so called job? And Ginny O'Brien's husband drawing taxpayer's money for his gig? Get real.
Second is attacks on Langley. When the exact same things were happening to McCabe he was defended. Vigorously and pretty much exactly as the DEMands blog is defending Langley.
I'll leave out the horrific attacks on Ann Taylor and those gender phobic evil comments. Only the Talks blog has stooped to that level of depravity.
And before all you Talks bloggers people fire back I "get" the whole "nah. nah a nah a they did it first" thing you so often argue.
So, put your big girl and boy pants on. Check the new majority like crazy. We all 100% support accountability in local government. But please stop pretending that the new majority is doing one damn thing differently than your very own political hacks did.
Judge the new majority fiercely, honestly and factually. We are all for that. But please stop pretending and writing comments that make you look every bit as disingenuous as Ginny O'Brien did when she spoke against double dipping - a practice she herself fully engaged in.
Dear 7:07 pm,
DeleteSadly, you hit the nail squarely on the head.. The irony is that the new majority is indeed not "doing one damn thing differently than " the previous majority.
The new Smart Way Forward majority ran on a strong reform platform, which they have seemed to have abandoned, based on its actions at the January 2nd Organizational meeting.
And that's a darn shame...
Bravo! (Jan 9 at 7:07 p.m.) And let's never forget about what they did to Rick Matters? After all these years of sticking with it through thick and thin, Rick finally had a chance to run for the county legislature until the so-called "McCabe run Democrats" interferred. They were calling him at work (setting him up for the kill) and Rick foolishly took and returned their calls on the work phone. Then, they filed a complaint against him for it which caused his employer to deny his request to run again FOR ANYTHING! If the MCCABE RUN DEMOCRATS left Rick Matters alone, Rick would have run for the county legislature and won (Mangold was destined to lose anyway...and she did!) and Mary Ann never would have thrown her hat in the ring. So, had they left Rick Matters alone, EG would have been RID of the Matters forevermore in town politics. But no, the genious DEMS had to do their vicious thing to Rick causing Mary Ann to run and now we have a new REPUB majority. So if anyone wants to blame anyone for anything, blame it on the DEMS who took down Rick Matters; it changed the course of political history in EG! Leaving Rick alone was the their best chance of holding on to the majority. The DEMS blew it big time when they messed with Rick Matters.
DeleteThis is sad. Rick was such a good man. I could just see him being trusting enough to believe that his colleagues on the board would never screw him like that behind his back. Boy was he wrong! Mary Ann is one angry "b" over what they did to Rick, and she makes no bones about it. It should make for some good exchanges on the dais between her, Mangold and Malone. The good news is that now EG has TWO MATTERS at the helm helping to steer the ship in the right direction. Mary Ann alone probably ain't much but with Rick by her side...yikes! Like I said, should be interesting over the next four years. I hope they rock & roll to make EG the awesome town we all know it can be with the right leadership. Let's give them a chance. Eleven days in is TOO SOON to start condemning them.
DeleteThe bigger shame is you have no idea what you’re talking about. Do a head count, the size of town government has shrunk. Anthony Corellis is a better DPW Commissioner than DVW could ever be. The town just hired the best Comptroller in its history including Jim B (and I liked Jim). You may like to tell yourself that nothing changed and if you want to believe that fine. But don’t try to sell it to me I see the glass half full
ReplyDelete@10:40 PM then why the need for a Deputy DPW Commissioner?
DeleteDear 10:40 PM:
ReplyDeleteHow about you do the entire town a tremendous service and put together an accounting of the financial impact of the 2014 Organizational Meeting?
Tell us all what positions were eliminated and what positions were added? Tell us all with factual accuracy the impact of all these changes on the town's finances?
That would be a wonderful service to the town and its chronically overburdened taxpayers.
Thank you very much.
Are you just lazy or not able to add. All the information is online.
DeleteFrankly Anony....I think 12:20 has a point. Online or not, an informational piece from the administration would be very helpful and very good PR if what they say is actually in there.
Deletesorry gadfly and 12:20 i'm not your office boy do your own work the information is out there so you can put it together yourself. Or you can keep making up stuff your choice
DeleteBoys and Girls....don't you just love the "'tude." Somebody wants to make a point and wants everybody else to bring the facts.
DeleteAnonymous 4:57: Nobody's asking you to be our 'office boy.' If the new majority doesn't have an analysis of the type requested at their fingertips then these decisions have been made in a vacuum. If they don't know the answers to these questions they don't know what they're doing. But I think they do have such an analysis and it would be an important step towards increasing public trust and confidence if they would share it. It doesn't have to be on this blog, but it would make for a nice handout at Wednesday's board meeting, And if they don't know, we're looking at the Blind Way Forward.
ReplyDeleteThanks Jack.....right on target.
DeleteOn the other hand, there is the fact that there was a bit of mischief related to the budgets and the final budget being the one with the tax increase. There could have been a tax cut, had the Supervisor's original budget been adopted. But we got an increase in taxes at the hands of some stubborn Reps who wanted language rather than a tax cut. So the new majority needs to explain whether the tax increase is being spent on their pork and patronage. Are expenses being cut or not? Keith, Mary Ann, Deb, Ed???
DeleteThere are those who don't want to be convinced that anything good will come from the new majority, so we shouldn't waste our time spoon-feeding them their requests for information. They're only going to argue the facts anyway because they don't want to accept that what happened last election day was inevitable since the Dems made such a colossal mess of the town's finances. Now that mess has been dropped in the laps of the new majority and some have the GALL to say they've gotten off to a bad start. No, 2014 has gotten off to a bad start because of the condition of the town. Let's hope 2015 starts to show some improvement. Until then, let the new majority work without the constant barrage of criticism. It's the least we can do for them under the circumstances.
ReplyDeleteEd...Just do the numbers. "Spoon-feeding" information??? The Dems made a mess of the Town, so your numbers should show a change in direction. So just do the numbers.
ReplyDeleteEd,
DeleteThis shouldn't be difficult. Remember, The Smart Way Forward Majority gave the voters a detailed governance plan through their weekly paid columns in The Advertiser during the weeks leading up to election day.
Unless,of course, the Smart Way Forward paid position papers were just a bunch of insincere slogans they never intended to follow up on after they got elected.
And that would be a darn shame...
Please be aware that we would love to see some good come of new leadership because we were sold this idea of "just get Keith the majority" and "we need two (sic, candidates)". We also waited two full years while Keith did little or nothing to improve the fiscal situation. Well, Keith and SWF got what they wanted and now we expect them to keep up their side of the bargain. For example, SWF promised zero based budgeting during their campaign. Is that now the plan? If so, how will it be achieved and if not, why not? It is the responsibility of informed citizens to ask for the fiscal plan and the obligation of elected officials to provide it. Please stop characterizing any inquiry as "a barrage of criticism". You are a newly appointed public servant. I don't consider you an "office boy" but you would be far more successful if you showed some respect for those you serve.
ReplyDeleteThere is very good news for East Greenbush citizens and taxpayers in these latest comments. It would appear we are now seeing the new majority and their political hacks for what they are - more useless politicians making decisions to help their political friends and hurts their political enemies instead of simply doing what is right by taxpayers.
ReplyDeleteThe question of accounting for the organizational changes is simply good business AND good politics. Instead we get defensive baloney, side stepping the issue, avoiding a simple question, going on the attack and other nonsense.
Okay, Ed, Chris and Keith - we got it. You don't know what you are doing in terms of managing OUR town in a business like manner.
Now do not be surprised when people do what they need to do to hold you accountable. Everyone who has commented on the point about asking you to account factually for your organizational changes is dead nuts right on.
Answer the darn question will you please. It is a basic, simple, valid, honest, decent question. Those of us who voted for the new majority deserve an answer to this excellent question.
It's beginning to look like the SWF is really not very politically savvy. What a positive, voter friendly, move it would be to publish a summary of the results of the Organizational Meeting actions. (That is if the actions were really voter friendly.) Maybe the lack of publication means that a lot of the "slush" money in the Dem's tax increase (adopted by the Reps) got spent on pork and patronage. We'll find out eventually folks. Is that why you're not putting it out there?
ReplyDeleteI've grown more tired of the blogs than I can possibly express... but not for the reasons one might think. The Dem blog is just trash. No one accountable. No legitimate discussions about governing. Nothing more than personal attacks to protect people who have not had the best interest of the town at heart, for way too long. Demands is no better. Simply an anonymous answer to the talks blog. Both cowardly spewing a bunch of garbage to promote their own agenda... which is NOT an agenda for the people of this town. Don's blog, far and away the best of the three, does it's best to keep things on track, but the anonymity of too many detracts from a worthwhile discourse. Not knowing who is responding on behalf of the party, detracts from the dialogue. My own anonymity is revealed in my writing style so there's no need to publish my name.
ReplyDeleteThere's a couple of quotes worth remembering by us all. First Shakespeare who said, "Nothing is neither good nor bad, but thinking makes it so." Everyone can toss comments about and everyone can express an opinion, but at the end of the day the only thing that really matters are the facts of it. Any administration worth it's salt should be willing and prepared to put all their cards on the table for the people they represent to dissect and interpret for themselves. Every question asked by a curious public should be answered for one reason... because those people pay your salaries and like it or not, everyone, including Michelangelo had a boss. The demise of the democrats in this town was in great part because they had too many secrets. They thought they knew more than the rest of us. In their opinion, it wasn't any of our business what they were doing. We should shut up, pay our taxes and leave the governing to them. Look where that approach got us folks. Unfortunately for the new administration, trust is a lost commodity in this town. It's gone. You have to EARN that privilege. You don't get to be arrogant, to tell us to assemble our own facts. You answer a curious public whether you like them or not. Whether they voted for you or not. You know why? Because THAT folks, IS America. We are NOT a democracy. We are a republic. A state where supreme power is held by the people. We are only a democracy in that this microcosm that we live in (EG) is ruled by a majority. For now, that lies in the hands of the republican party in East Greenbush. That does not make the people any less important in this equation. (for the record, requesting numbers or facts or breakdowns should not be done on a blog. If you want something from the administration, ask THEM, not here. Once denied, THEN complain about it!)
The other quote worth noting is that, "A mob is no less a mob just because they are with you." The democrats in this town acted like an angry tyrannical mob and got exactly what they deserved as a result. An opinion shared by a number of democrats as well as other parties. The new majority need not act like a mob. Just because you may not like the blog or the people who run it is not justification for dismissing a good idea. It doesn't merit ignoring constructive criticism. No political party knows more about what people want and need than the people in need or want. It's time for everyone to take a step back and start acting like grown ups. Start governing for God's sake rather than ruling. The arrogance is so unbecoming that it is reminiscent of soviet, fascist or communist rule. Where we don't care what you think or want. Just leave everything to us. That is NOT who we are as a people or what we voted for. To many people fought for the opportunity to bring this town in a new direction to accept anything less than a modicum of respect from the people who accept our tax dollars.
To be continued.....
We don't care if you like us or our attitudes. You should remember that WE put you where you are and you can only stay there as long as you learn from the mistakes of the people you replaced. It's time for some humbleness. To lay your swords down for a minute and take stock in where you are. Listen to the people around who want you to succeed, not the people who are accepting your table scraps of perks and rewards for working by your side. Listen to people of intellect who are right to remind you that sharing of information, an open and honest government will get you further faster than this cloak and dagger approach you're taking. If you want to play your cards close to the vest... play cards and get out of government. In the meanwhile, while you're on OUR clock, be a little more contrite, open, open minded, forthcoming and for the love of God, willing to admit when you've made a mistake. The good people of this town are far more forgiving of a minor indiscretion than they are of the pig headed desire to prove how right you are and how much smarter you are than the rest of us. Sometimes, being willing to admit when you're wrong is the best way to win over your would be adversary.
ReplyDeleteFor everyone else... governing in this town after decades of abusive reign is a daunting undertaking for any party and any administration. We may not agree with the approach or some of the decisions, but to a certain degree, to the victors go the spoils. The spoils period is over now, they've been dolled out. To a certain degree, we have to take on faith that the new administration has our best interest at heart, in part because they said so and in part because they really haven't had an opportunity to do anything that can have a significant impact in a positive way. It's not wrong for us to want to see the road map or proven numbers, but perhaps the best way to fix the town is together. A sharing of ideas. When the new administration starts to mirror the old one, they should be prepared to accept the same fate. When you lose the confidence of your closest friends and advisers you have to believe in your heart of hearts that you're doing something wrong. Finding out the hard way is a terrible way to find out.
Success is going to have to be with a little bit of trust on everyone's part and a little bit of swallowing of pride. Numbers don't lie. FOILS are a waste of everyone's time. If they are requested, you should assume that it's for a reason you may not have thought of. You should tap into the collective intellect of everyone interested. And if that's not your way, if you think you know better than you should be prepared, because you just aren't cut out for government. Maybe private industry is a better place. It can be argued that the democrats did as much to lose as the republicans did to win. That can only mean that you weren't elected... you were selected by default. There' is a huge difference! There is always someone else waiting in the wings to take you down. Don't go out like suckers... some of us think you can turn the town around... we just think you need more help than you're willing to accept.
To be continued.....
Of course, like all these anonymous comments, this could just be a selfish rant and simply one person's opinion. Listen, don't listen, I don't care. This is an objective opinion of what's out there right now. Not for or against anyone, but here's something to consider. The town website is set up for it's own blog. Offer residents a forum for actual discussion and perhaps put an end to the useless anonymous blogs. Promote constructive ideas from people willing to sign their names and ONLY those who are willing to sign their names. That's how the town website can best promote your administration. You can actually respond there. Communicate with the public in a meaningful way if not in person. You want to be better and different than the other guy. You want the SMART way forward? Then do what they didn't have the guts to do. Try it! You might be surprised by the positive results. Greater input can only yield better results and if it's considered and dismissed for a better idea, just make sure the better idea yields better results or be prepared to try the dismissed idea.
ReplyDeleteTwo years is not a lot of time to accomplish things... make the most of it.
Maybe I'm just too inexperienced at this to offer an opinion and maybe I don't know as much as you guys, but I can promise one thing for sure... I paid dearly for the right to express this opinion.
Signed... Just another taxpayer
Just another taxpayer:
ReplyDeleteThis is a really important set of statements. Forgive me because I'm in the third day of taking care of my 18-month old granddaughter and my brain is mush but I have no idea who you are and that negates the critical point you made about anonymous bloggers. You employ a very sophisticated argument about the nature of government in an open society; I was intending to make a shorter, though similar, statement at tonight's town board meeting. It's the first full meeting of the new majority and it might help them to get off on the right foot. I hope you will identify yourself more clearly for zombies like me but either way you hit the ball out of park.
Secret government is always bad government because it means either they don't know what they're doing or they're hiding something. The new majority ran against the old way of doing things and now have a responsibility to change the method of governing in this town. This is OUR government, not theirs, and except for the personnel information that requires an executive session, all business they conduct is based on information that belongs to us, not them. For all your modesty you are clearly more than just another taxpayer because most taxpayers in this town have no idea how their hard earned money is used to govern East Greenbush.
Let me see if I can summarize: Smart Way Forward, you work for us taxpayers not for yourselves and your immediate circle. Remember Mr. Malone's "civics lesson" - we're the majority and what we pass passes. You need to remember that you won the majority, not so much on your own steam, but on the fact that the Dem majority had been discredited by a whole bunch of poor governing. The replacement of the Maney/McCabe/Malone machine with the DeFruscio/Langley machine, with similar behaviors is simply not acceptable.
ReplyDeleteI think there are three primary reasons why politicians, of both parties in East Greenbush, lie and hide things:
ReplyDelete1.) They are lazy. They do not do the research, they do not sweat the details. They make political decisions instead of well thought out decisions.
2.) They are incompetent. They are just plain dumb. They compound this situation by surrounding themsleves with syncophants and other dummies.
3.) They are corrupt. They spend other people's money (That's ours readers) on themselves, their family members and their friends.
East Greenbush has examples of all three failings by both political parties.
East Greenbush also has a large, and growing, population of caring citizens. Some came to early CARE meetings. Some come to town board meetings. Some speak at meetings. Some read and write on blogs - mostly this one.
Things are changing, Slowly; but they are changing. Will the new majority move in the right direction? Unlikely. So far they are showing signs of all three major failings - lazy, incompetent and corrupt. Is the last too harsh? Maybe but the organizational meeting if not evidence of corruption is awfully, awfully close.
I predict Langley will be a one term supervisor. Despite efforts by his own syncophants like Ed Gilbert Langley clearly suffers from at least two of the three political failings and the jury is still out on the third.
We will all hope and watch Matters and DiMartino. But the early evidence suggests they are not independent of chairperson DeFruscio and he suffers clearly and in large amounts of all three political failings.
The biggest hope for taxpayers is an emerging third party independent of the Maney, Malone, Hart, DeFruscio, Langley collection of fools and thieves.
Am I bitter as I write this? Sure. Am I deeply in error? I doubt it but let's wait just a little and see what Matters and DiMartino are all about.
Jack it was finally nice to meet you. Even though are political affiliations are in different arenas we prove that we may be as different as night and day, but we can come together on common grounds, I wish the town could learn to do the same. Until the town's elected officials learn that everything should revolve sound ethics and morality I fear that the towns problems will persist
ReplyDeleteJim_C - It was nice to finally meet you too. You and I approach the substance of politics in different ways but we seem to agree that the basis of good government is the same regardless of ideology - civility, ethical conduct, transparency, honesty. It is too early to know how the new majority will govern and I wish them well but if they resort to the same old cut and slash of East Greenbush politics then we're in trouble. I am eternally optimistic so I'm very hopeful they made the right appointments and our government will function effectively but there's a tough road ahead. They have to lower taxes and reduce the debt and they have to do it in an open transparent manner. I wish them well.
ReplyDeleteFrom that Board meeting Wednesday night some things were very clear.
ReplyDeleteKeith Langley is rude. The way he treated Tom Grant was deplorable. Keith allowed one speaker to stand at his chair and speak but would not allow Tom to speak until he went to the podium and THEN scolded Tom for addressing the audience as well as the Board. Keith is NOT giving fair and equitable treatment to each resident. In addition, his display with Phil Malone was plain unprofessional and nasty. Keith was completely unprofessional and down right nasty which lead to creating a tension in the room for ALL OF US! Phil had valid concerns and questions which Keith should have addressed. Rather, Keith responds, "I am moving forward with the vote you can vote for or against, I don't care what you do." What kind of response is THAT from the Supervisor to a fellow Board member???? Phil's concerns/questions were legitimate and should have been addressed, in a professional manner.
Keith is, quite successfully, after only ONE Board meeting under his new administration, turning residents off and turning them to Phil. THAT'S RIGHT! I said it--turning to Phil! Phil was conversing with residents after the meeting. Keith, on the other hand, put his head in the air and strode out of the room. FOR SHAME!
Keith--we get it. You are now in the glorious position of being in the majority. Hooray for you. But never forget who held that seat prior to you and HE was in the majority as well and once HE was sharp with the residents at Board meetings and once HE became arrogant and behaved as if he was invincible he was voted right off that dais. Once HIS transgressions were caught and publicized, HE was voted out of that corner office, in Town Hall, which WE the residents OWN.
WE own Town Hall, not Keith. Wednesday evening Jack very politely reminded everyone of that fact. Keith would be wise to contemplate and ponder that thought.
As a resident that Phil spoke with after the meeting, I thank Phil for approaching me and speaking with me. He was a gentleman to me Wednesday evening and I appreciated our conversation.
You were all warned ! I tried - obviously in vain - to implore you all to see thru the smokescreen - dog and pony show - that was erroneously labeled "Smart Way Forward" !
ReplyDeleteIts a scam people. There are NO good intentions by any of them. They will take the dems to school and show them how patronage,nepotism and cronyism are handled. The appointments made on Jan.02 are just the beginning.
I hate to say it - but I told you so ! I am not rubbing it in, but again, I was not fooled by Defruscio and his childish maneuvers to steal the election.
You all wanted change - YOU GOT IT ! It went from a "D" to an "R" and the "R" is worse !
You don't seem to get the picture, "I tried to tell you"....... The Dems were discredited and sent packing for just the behavior you say you see in the DeFruscio run operation. What you may not see and what they may not see is that the same fate awaits. They're really setting up a Third alternative. We certainly don't want the Dems back unless they show some different colors, which is unlikely. Reform is now closer than you may think. As has been said many times now, the old ways are just not acceptable any longer. They're just too expensive.
DeleteDear Anonymous 8:21 AM,
ReplyDeleteThank you for the terrific post!
At last week's Town Board meeting I was indeed pleasantly surprised and honored to be invited by Mr. Langley to speak from the podium. Although I have to admit that I felt a bit uncomfortable that my friends Jack Conway and Floyd Hunt were not afforded the same consideration by the Supervisor when they made their own very trenchant comments.
I think I speak for at least some of the residents choosing to comment at Board meetings, that while we are indeed addressing the Board we are not addressing the Board exclusively.
In my opinion and in the opinion of many others, even though Mr. Hunt and Mr. Conway were not also invited by the Supervisor to share their views from the privilege of the podium, they were easily able to command the full attention of everyone in the room, elected and non-elected residents alike.
Tom, why don't you consider coming over and being a Dem; better yet a councilperson when the time comes. You'd be perfect. You could also try for Supervisor; at least your not a social misfit and people really do like you! You've got just as good a chance as anyone else. Keith is beginning to show his real colors; Oh this is my family as he points to his family portrait - is he a phoney or what? He'll fall apart one of these days and they'll be taking him out in a straight jacket.
DeleteIt's premature to conclude that the new majority can't do the job, I'll admit they've stumbled out of the gate but Deb DiMartino and Mary Ann Matters have been councilors for seventeen days. Think of something you're really good at and try to remember how good you were after seventeen days. My two main criticisms have been the way personnel changes were handled and the failure to provide a public rationale for the steps being taken.
ReplyDeleteAdmittedly, it looks like the same wine in a new bottle but do we really know that yet? Criticizing the new DPW commissioner for not being up to Dave Van Wormer's level after two weeks isn't really fair. Dave was very good in that job and he got better as he went so there's going to be a learning curve while Mr. Corellis gets settled. Transitions are tough, feathers have been ruffled, and campaign promises turn out to be, well, campaign promises. Nobody's going to ask more questions than me or be more critical if they fail but fairness dictates that they be given some time to find their sea legs.
They're not going anywhere and neither am I but it's going to take some time to know if their approach will work. if my taxes go down and the town's municipal credit rating goes up, we'll be singing a different song because that's what matters. If not, we say good grief and good riddance and move on in two years.
To "I tried to tell you"---You seem to be unable to comprehend the issue. The issue was never about R's being better than D's. The issue is getting the RIGHT people, ethical, civil, respectful, HONEST people in there. NEVER was I a Keith fan, NEVER. I was always vocal about my skepticism with Keith and lack of trust in him. That being said, I certainly no longer desired a stipend stealing, scrap revenue neglecting rude man in there either!
ReplyDeleteTom Grant the elder--you are dead on and thank you for the compliment regarding my post. Each resident should be afforded fair and equitable treatment as we ALL pay the same taxes and we all accept the same tax fate. You, Sir, were very rudely treated and it was due to a prejudice on the part of Supervisor Langley. At some point he should contemplate the fate of the previous Supervisor because Keith is wearing his shoes and following THAT guy down the yellow brick road....the problem with this yellow brick is there is no OZ at the end....just the kingdom of unemployment.
Unless Keith wants to see a couple of candidates that would be his adversaries from a third party alternative, he should wise up and learn to be courteous, civil, respectful and thoughtful to EVERYONE. That includes all fellow Board members as well as residents! If Keith was a gentleman, a true gentleman in every sense of the word, he would behave as one. At this point, some of us would settle for him being a man.
If Keith wants to win some people back to his camp---start dealing with the old stipend issues. Look into recouping some of those funds! He should be able to maintain civility and courtesy to all fellow Board members and residents if he does look into recouping some funds.
For now, I will keep an open door with Phil. Sue Mangold--Wednesday evening, her questions/concerns/points were spot on. I look forward to watching both Sue and Phil in this role, as the minority. We, as taxpayers, benefit when EVERY Board member is questioning how and why our tax dollars are being spent.
To Jack--agreed regarding new personnel and Board members. Keith is not a new Board member. My critique was in reference to Keith's dismissive behavior and remarks to Phil and his unbalanced approach to Tom Grant. There is no "learning curve" to being polite and courteous and Keith's display was one of partiality towards some and down right hostile to some. Keith's behavior made the tension in that room palatable and with the financial burdens this Town faces, there is no room for tolerance of that behavior.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 8:21: I was really uncomfortable during the exchanges between Keith and Phil. But there's a learning curve there too as Phil has to figure out the best way to represent a minority and Keith the best approach to being in charge. But there's no doubt Keith could have done better. Phil will push his buttons every chance he gets. I agree completely with your statement about Sue Mangold: she was professional and her questions clarified the resolutions and advanced the discussion. The treatment of Tom Grant was uncalled for, especially since Tom is always substantive and positive in his contributions. He's also one of the nicest guys in town which showed when he responded to the unequal treatment with a mix of good humor and pointed commentary. We definitely agree more than we disagree.
ReplyDeleteI believe Keith Langley is often terrified and when he is terrified he exhibits boorish behavior, inappropriate for ANY person much less a Town Supervisor elected by the people.
ReplyDeleteKeith Langley asked the voters to give him a new majority. They did and now Keith has no idea what to do with it. Supervisor Keith's default mode over the last two years when asked to make a decision about anything related to his job as Town Supervisor is to (1.) Feel sorry for himself and (2.) Try to blame someone else for asking him to make a decision.
Keith is intimidated by anyone who might raise any issues which he or Chris DeFruscio are unable to readily process and understand.
@1:57 uses the words "dismissive" and "unbalanced" to describe Keith's approach to Phil Malone and Tom Grant at the last TB meeting. Those are the perfect word to describe Keith's approach to governing as a whole. Keith Langley has no interest in balancing different concerns in order to achieve a workable consensus to make Town government work FOR its residents. He instead prefers to dismiss differing opinions as not worthy of his consideration . As someone who has worked closely with Keith over the past two years described to me, "Keith knows what he knows and that is it."
As a result, Keith is highly sensitive and highly uncomfortable with any type of questioning from taxpayers simply interested in finding out how Keith and the SWF majority intend to spend their tax dollars.
I still hold out some hope that Deb and Mary Ann will shortly realize the unbalanced and dismissive Langley approach to governing is not what their large numbers of supporters voted for on election day.
I can tell all of you from having a number of private one on one conversations with Keith Langley that he is rude, outrageously vulgar, loud to the point of screaming and nasty. And, no, I am not Dave Van Wormer.
ReplyDeleteNow we are seeing signs of similar behavior in public from Langley.
I supported Langley. Right up to the point where I got to know him and Chris DeFruscio, and Sean Mulvey and Ed Gilbert a whole lot better. They are not the solution to the town's problems.
Rick McCabe was rude and nasty toward the end of his reign as supervisor as well.
Phil Malone has never been an example of shining virtue either.
Will Langley learn? I doubt it. Two years - Keith. Better start preparing for the prospects of unemployment.
I have a feeling that Mr. Langley has become the "lightening rod" for a whole bunch of accumulated ire from some people who helped him get elected a couple of years ago and then he "dissed" at the instruction of Mr. DeFruscio. DeF is still running in the old "boss" mode (read the Sopranos). He wasn't elected to anything except the Party job. And those elected to the Board don't have a prayer of success if they don't cut the "boss" loose and start to govern for all the people.
ReplyDeleteDear Sword,
ReplyDeleteIt's good EG Gadfly people are calling Langley out on his behavior. Might make him a better person someday.
With all due respect, I think it's DeF who needs the learning curve improvement. And Langley needs to learn some independence. He could really make a difference in the Town along with Deb and Mary Ann, but he still thinks he won a beauty contest two years ago (as DeF keeps telling him) instead of replacing a discredited administration.
DeleteSorry anonymous I saw it as Phil badgering Keith the other night. To me he just kept going and going with the supervisor, and Keith just finally said, look Phil we are moving forward vote whatever way you want to vote, end of story.
ReplyDeleteAs far as the way he treated Tom Grant, I didn't like that either and thought there was a little prejudice there too. Especially after other people were allowed to talk from their seats.
Well just my opinion.
I'm sure Phil and Tom and whoever wants too will badger Supe whenever they can and that's the name of the game. Years ago; Politicians got along and tried to work together; well that ain't gonna happen anymore.
DeleteIts an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. The Repubs have showed that they can win; but in two years they'll have to face a New Supervisor.
12:20 PM,
DeleteOne person's badgering is another person's questioning. In any event, Mr Langley should strive to treat everyone in a civil and respectful manner. Mr. Langley fell far short of what is expected in a public official. He seems to be following the pattern of Mr McCabe.
I think they could all still get along, just being an optimist I guess. Stop fighting over the BS and do what is right for the people. Was it really necessary to fire Van Wormer? I don't think so, but maybe it will turn out better, I guess we will see in the coming months. Thats what I mean stop it with the BS and do what is right for all, not what is right for some.
DeleteJust because phil is on one side and Langley is on the other doesn't mean they can't get along. As a matter of fact they should get along it would be beneficial to everyone in this town if they did. Phil made his point, and it was a good and just point, but he didn't need to keep going back at it. I actually sided with him on this, but I just felt he kept going and going like the energizer bunny, and that turned me off. If he thought what he was doing was right he should have stated that and moved on, no grudges at the end of the day they still have to work together.
The same goes for Langley now he thinks he is king of the mountain, you work for us too, and at the end of the day we can vote you out just as well as we voted you in. Its just that simple.
Jim_C,
ReplyDeleteI'm glad you were at the meeting. Dedicated citizens like you are important to the Town. My take on the Langley-Malone back and forth is Langley was giving nonsense answers to Malone's questions about when and if the Langley appointed Town Assessor planned to move to East Greenbush from her home in Castleton. I think it's important if a person is going to be responsible for assessing the value of all properties in East Greenbush she should be required to live in East Greenbush. That's what Malone was trying to find out from Langley, but Langley kept dodging Malone's questions. Langley became increasing tongue tied as Malone tried to pin him down and then Langley angrily ended the discussion by saying "I don't care how you vote." IMHO Langley should begin to prepare for these Board meetings now that he runs the majority, instead of just winging it like he did the other night.
804- I agree with you. Malone and Mangold both were well prepared for the issues discussed at the board meeting. Langley is going to have to step up his game in order to accurately respond to their questions. He's going to need to consult with somebody other than Defruscio before the meetings.
ReplyDeleteI hope the Board members continue to ask each other questions. Since it looks like the SWF majority board members are the only ones to be allowed to move and second resolutions without any meaningful input from the minority board members, it is totally appropriate and reasonable for Mangold and Malone to ask the Langley SWF majority to explain the details of the resolutions Langley SWF board members are moving and seconding.
ReplyDeleteJust because Langley and Rick Matters chose not to do this when they were in the minority should not preclude Mangold and Malone from asking questions.
These questions might very well lead to a more open and transparent government for East Greenbush, which ironically was part of the Langley SWF campaign platform.
Do you all not see that Phil M(alone) was goading the Supr into a confrontation on bd nite and that (scary thought) Malone is campaigning now for the Supr's job in two years? We didn't see Mangold acting outrageously disrespectful that night. She's smart enough to know who's in control now by the will of the people. Does anyone really want to see a Supr Malone in two years? Hell no! He's a petty, little man who refuses to take his share of the blame for the town's fiscal crisis. Instead, he's doing his level best to antagonize the Supr and continue to be part of the problem rather than part of the solution. Can we pls stop the Supr-bashing and give the new majority a chance to work? C'mon bloggers be reasonable.
ReplyDeleteCould you please just explain the give and take of politics to Keith? What Malone was doing the other night was just what Keith should have been doing during the 2 years he wasted. If Keith had embrased the role of minority member when he should have, he could have contributed to Malone taking his share of the blame for the fiscal crisis. Keith ran for this office and I expect him to do the work (which includes answering taxpayers questions).
DeleteEd, you would be doing yourself and the Supervisor a favor if you stopped looking at questions and offers to help as "bashing".
@ 1109- Malone wasn't being disrespectful. He was just trying to get a straight answer from Langley as to whether Langley's choice for Town Assessor planned to move to EG. The only disrespectful person I saw at the TB meeting was Langley the way he treated a man in the audience. I think Langley got angry because his attempt to intimidate the man backfired so he was spoiling for a fight. Langley clearly didn't have any idea if or when his Assessor planned to move to EG. Kudos to Malone for bringing that out.
DeleteEvery time I see SWF, I think of the old movie Single White Female. The chick in that flick was quite the psycho; this Supe-led/Chris-led bumbling group shows signs of governing along the same lines. I'm sure Ed Shillbert, the bloviating, not-so-incognito, Republican blogging mouthpiece can assure us that all is well (nothing to see here)!
ReplyDeleteSo essentially, the Supe told Old Phil that his pittance of a vote was of no concern - in other words, the new Supe Majority, is the majority, and they will vote as they will. What goes around, comes around.
So we hire people from Castleton and we send our Bruen Rescue Squad there as well? Can we do anything else to accommodate that community - I love seeing my tax $ go abroad. Please, I have an endless supply of money - give it to all nearby communities. Ginny O'Brien's husband is still nearby - maybe we can still give him some $ as well.
Nightmare defined: EG Town Government. Perhaps all we need is just one individual - one independent candidate to successfully take the Supervisor position - and we can take power away from the self-indulgent party that has devastated this town and the other that aims to replicate that self-indulgence to the further detriment of the town. A true independent, right in the middle, and the power-hungry Party people possibly could be neutralized. Arrogance needs to be vanquished.
Anonymous Jan 17@ 11:06--Reasonable? I pose this question to YOU. The number of times McCabe and Malone were disrespectful to Rick Matters, Rick Matters maintained a courteous manner and professional behavior. Rick Matters always maintained a respectful attitude towards Malone, McCabe as well as Ginny O'Brien. The Supervisor would be wise to learn that lesson form Rick Matters.
ReplyDeleteAs far as "who is in control now"...that is rather pompous and exactly what the PEOPLE are tired of experiencing. The PEOPLE want to see what is right and ethical. We do NOT want to watch one party inflict political vengeance on another.
As far as Malone "goading" Keith Langley.....Keith should maintain a professional demeanor. If your excuse regarding Malone "goading" Keith is correct...what is Keith Langley's excuse for his treatment of Tom Grant? He allowed 2 other gentlemen to speak from their seats and BOTH addressed everyone, not simply the Board. Tom Grant suffers the same tax fate we all suffer and deserves the same polite and courteous treatment that Jack and Floyd received.
Sometimes, those who are so entwined in politics need to take a step back and breathe. Look objectively at the situation. Keith's behavior was wrong, plain wrong. Keith made the room uncomfortable with his discourteous treatment of Tom. The tension, at times, was palpable and that is on Keith. He owned the tension because he created it. If he continues on this path, he will mirror McCabe's last two years in office.....and he will have nobody to blame but himself...certainly not Phil Malone.
Think objectively. Keith is a dictator....many of us know that to be true based on our personal experiences with him. He dictates who people can and cannot associate with and he dictates to a fellow Board meeting, DURING the meeting. He dictates to a tax paying resident where they can stand when posing an issue or making a comment YET, he does not show that same scolding to other residents when they speak. Bottom line....Keith often behaves like a bully and the last bully was voted out. Keith and company should remember that.
Also, Keith does not want everyone's involvement and has directed his "followers" to steer clear of any interaction with some individuals. Is that really what we want running this Town? A rude, disrespectful dictator that gives jobs to his party Chairperson? Think about the whole situation OBJECTIVELY.
Malone and Mangold asking questions--I welcome that! Protect my tax dollars. Until Keith addresses the money we lost by the previous administration, there is NO ROOM for the new administration to complain about Phil. When the new administration rights some of the financial wrongs THEN they can get on their high horses. Work on recouping some of our funds...THAT should be one of Keith's focuses...NOT where Tom Grant stands at a Board meeting.
Well said 8:21. I find they all have this narcissistic attitude instead of being kind and gentle with the people of the Town, going out there when someone is in crisis, checking out the situation. I think Mike VanVoris needs to give a "charm" class to Langley and Malone. For Def there is no hope. In order to win an election, you have to be well-liked more than anything; you have to do something during your time of running that will make you stand out, now in a crowd - within the Town and Langley has failed at that; nobody even knows who he is??? Yes Phil can be gruff; whether he wins or not, that's to be seen; Now Sue Mangold on the other hand would not have to do a whole hell of a lot to WIN; her personality and her kind and giving ways to EVERYONE she comes in contact with would win her that election. so wake up people; Langley fell into this seat and he will definitely fall out of it just as quickly as he came into it. Hope Rifenburg takes him back!!
DeleteI didn't vote for or support a "what goes around comes around" attitude from the people in charge of my tax dollars. That's all most people want is an honest, fair and decent government who doesn't abuse their position and or take the public for granted. Government isn't a platform for personal revenge. You want to get back at Phil, challenge him to a game of chess. While you're doing the work of the people, please put your own bias and opinion aside for the greater good and treat everyone equally and with respect. I get that all the dems had to go. They earned that by the way they treated people the last time, destroying computers and records. Some things are necessary for survival and to be able to move your agenda forward. But now it's our agenda as well. Be as open as you promised and don't let the minority force your hand and remove your court attendant. Have him step aside with dignity and appoint someone else. It only says your administration is for sale for $75 a night. It's time for statesmen not a bunch of political hacks getting even. You won for God's sake... Act like it!
ReplyDeleteWell this is a new wrinkle folks....EGDemands is now open to invited readers only.
ReplyDeleteThis blog is open to invited readers only
http://egdemands.blogspot.com/
It doesn't look like you have been invited to read this blog. If you think this is a mistake, you might want to contact the blog author and request an invitation.
It's dumb and dumber in my book. Langley, what in the world are you thinking?? Mary Ann and Deb, do you want to be associated with this stuff?
It's a Grand Old Party and you are not invited. That's the Langley and DeFruscio Smart Way Forward?
ReplyDeleteYou'd think after appointing myself the Lord I would at least be invited to read EG DEMands. I might have to rain down a plague of locusts or cause a massive drought. Fear is a paralyzing emotion so I hereby apologize to the anonymous lightweights who froze that blog for being one of the people who scared the shit out of them. I don't blame you, though, because if I had no answers I would just ignore the questions too. I guess DEMands is pretty much just a circle jerk now.
ReplyDeletePerhaps we should assume a couple of things before we look a gift horse in the mouth. We asked for better governing, we asked them to be responsive. Unlike the talks blog, the demands blog was obviously run by someone in favor of the administration and obviously the administration encouraged them to take it down and stop some of this back biting back and forth. For that I say bravo to whomever was responsible. It demonstrates an effort to be responsive and do better. We can't always complain and then complain some more when things turn around a bit. The anonymous blogs are bad news and the Talks blog represented some of the worst stuff that's ever been put out in the public domain, to the extent that they have had to actually delete comments that were over the top. Demands never got to that point. Maybe it's best if for now, we commend those who put an end to that kind of message and encourage them to stay on a path to do better. It's a refreshing change and maybe if they were to create a blog on the town website there wouldn't be a need for this blog OR the talks blog. Either way, the blogs would become irrelevant and the only one that would matter is the one that we all own. I say kudos to whomever accepted responsibility for a vehicle of information that was taking things in a wrong direction and encouraging more vitriol on the web. Thank you! Well done.
ReplyDeleteMy, my 5:53 PM, do you have a short and/or selective memory. Just last week the former DEMands blog deleted a comment about a ficticious Dem. meeting supposedly held at a fashionable bistro overlooking the Hudson River in the City of Rensselaer. Throughout its checkered history, the DEMands blog deleted comments on a frequent basis. You could look it up!!!
Delete@ 5:53 AM, Let me get this straight. You state "obviously the( Langley) administration encouraged them to take it (the DEMands blog) down..."
ReplyDeleteTwo questions:
1. What proof do you offer?
2. If true, why wouldn't the Langley administration have taken the opportunity to outline its goals and objectives on that or any other blog, instead of encouraging them to take it down?
Sadly ,Mr. Langley inexplicably continues to remain resistant to sharing and discussing public information with the general public and other elected officials as he most recently demonstrated at the last Town Board meeting.
And that's not "refreshing" that's a shame...
While I can agree with most of what you say, I would like to point out that Demands was far worse than Talks. Here's why: Demands never posted any comment of substance, baseless gossip only and Demands made no attempt to print the truth. Chris, who often bragged he was the author, set out to do harm to the citizens of East Greenbush so I'm glad it is down. As far as talks goes, they often have information of value. They are heavy on name calling and gossip but not completely worthless.
ReplyDeleteThis is probably a good time to say keep up the good work, Gadfly.
The DEMands blog has gone the way of most bullies. When bullies are confronted by righteous folk, they turn tail and run away.
ReplyDeleteGod bless America!!
5:53---I would never want to see THIS blog abolished regardless of what the Town creates on its own website. The reason--THIS blog in unbiased and objective. A Town blog on a Town website would be biased and would simply parrot the Supervisor's Report.
ReplyDeleteWhile removing Demands was wise, they should never have used specific names (and spelling them correctly). A thought Ronald Reagan once imparted to his daughter when she was caught smoking in school, comes to mind. Realizing what you did was wrong is commendable and you should be forgiven but, for the wrong doing there are still consequences. Defruscio/Gilbert/Langley deleting their blog is the right move and an acknowledgement that it was wrong but consequences are still in order and if the path they have chosen continues to be paved with arrogance and questionable acts/decisions than removing that blog has no impact; it was simply to protect their hides.
To DEMANDS:
ReplyDeleteChris & Keith---you use my name as well as other's names on your blog. You have no consideration for the fact that we are all private citizens and certainly entitled to our opinions based on observations of YOUR actions and decisions. So, on that note, I believe it is best to inform the public of the "quality" of your character.
A month ago, I hosted a small Christmas party at my home. Some of the invited guests received a phone call from Chris warning them NOT to attend my party. Unfortunately for Chris and Keith I am a darn good cook and they attended and shared these phone calls with all of us the party. This is the second time in 2 years Keith/Chris have told people not to come to my home. Chris & Keith have also warned people not to talk to my friends--all of whom were at my party.
Do we, the residents of East Greenbush, want the Town controlled by dictators?
And yes, DEMANDS--I did have a conversation with Phil after the Board meeting. Phil was polite to me, walked me to my car and we had a professional conversation regarding the Town and some issues. Last I knew, my tax dollars contribute to EVERY councilperson's salary, as well as the Supervisor's and the Night Court Bailiff. In addition, this is the USA and I have the right to speak to anyone I want and that includes my representatives in government. Chastising me for speaking with Phil proves the dictator style of management and governing you have chosen. I simply exercise my rights to talk to anyone I like. Chris---as a man that served this Country you should understand that and champion an individual's rights.
Sincerely,
A.T.
Ann, as another private citizen that had their name used on that other blog, it bothers me that the blog administrator would let stuff like that happen. it also bothers me that some people have no class, no ethics, no morals. What the hell is wrong with people?
DeleteAll we want is good honest government, is that so hard to understand?
As a taxpayer, I appreciated Sue Mangold's questions/concerns at the Town Board Meeting. When Board members question how our tax dollars are spent, we all benefit.
ReplyDeleteIt seems some do not understand that a resident does not need to be involved in politics to attend Board meetings and ask questions as well as have concerns. It's a shame. Why the fear of questions? Why the fear of residents speaking with Councilpersons? Ignorance breeds fear and maybe that is why Defruscio/Langley are afraid of questions.
Their juvenile remarks are more evidence of what the Town is dealing with. They can rest assured, nobody in the "back row" has any interest in running for anything so they can take a deep breath and start governing. The "back row" simply wants the Town to make prudent decisions and treat all residents with courtesy.
Maybe they should be more concerned about the Town's issues and dealing with the Town's finances and less concerned about who attends whose Christmas parties and who talks to whom and where the public sits at Board meetings. They are dragging the Town's governing further into a ditch.
I wish a couple of people in the back row would run.... I for one would help them out any way possible.
DeleteAre you freakin kidding me? Defruscio and Langley put the word out there for people to NOT go to your Christmas Party. They also put the word out that anyone who remotely speaks to or goes to a Malone committee meeting will be tossed after January 1st. There's got to be an attorney around that will take this case; this is called "threatening." What people need to start doing is taping these conversations; with any luck they'll stand up in a court of law. Isn't Supe being sued? This might be his lucky year. Maybe Malone and Taylor ought to start their own committee; I for one would join them!! Lets go guys! Get these losers in two years; ya got nothing to lose; except you'll get a lot more respect from the DEMS. We had a GREAT committee who worked their butts off to win year after year; we can do it again starting N O W.
ReplyDeleteIs the head of the Rep party in Rens County aware of what is going on with Langley and Def? If not, he should be told. If he does know and ignores it, maybe a third party should be formed. I am only one voter, but that is one less Rep vote in the next election.
ReplyDeleteGoing to Wordpress....Now I have to tell Chris my e-mail address if I want to tell him he's one sick puppy. No way. I'll do it here.
ReplyDeleteEast Greenbush citizens finally can compare the two dominant political parties that attempt to rule the town and the people of the town.
ReplyDeleteThe picture cannot be pretty. Neither political party is about anything other than each other. They fight the wrong fights; they want the wrong things. They are blinded by their hatred of each other.
What a mess. Malone, O'Brien and Mangold were failures in every sense of the word. The voters replaced them with a new majority.
So far the new majority is showing themselves to be no better. Not one darn bit better. The same rudeness, the same arrogance, the same stupidity, the same disregard for the people, the same ineptness in doing the right things the right way.
But there is good news. The good news is that the new majority has exposed themselves for what they are. The good news is that East Greenbush voters are more well informed than ever - thanks primarily to this blog and less so to the local newspapers. The good news is that people are smart, perceptive, analytical and...they remember.
In two years we get to let the new majority know what we think of their foolishness - with our votes.
Personally, I think we know for certain now that only an emerging third party independent of people like Phil Malone, Kim Halloran and Chris DeFruscio will do what is right for taxpayers.
Jim_C--apparently good, honest government it is too much to ask for. Some are none too pleased that Phil and I had a conversation and that is truly pathetic. The fact is Phil is one of my representatives in government and I can converse with anyone I like about anything I like.
ReplyDeleteRather than focusing on the Town's issues there is a focus on what some individuals are saying and doing.
Sick of the Slugs--No, it is no joke. That is what happened and it is still going on.
ReplyDeleteThere's a lot of static in the airwaves of local politics lately. Dueling blogs, dueling town board members, even, it seems, dueling members of the audience at the last town board meeting. Any change of government causes hard feelings because people lose their jobs and that's a serious matter. But I think the problem is systemic and could be solved if we put our heads together.
ReplyDeleteThe problem is that there is no effective forum for residents to speak with their elected representatives in public. The question and answer session was taken out of the town board meetings. There's no doubt that it made meetings longer and more contentious but there was a valuable exchange of information. Unlike national and sometimes state officials, local representatives don't hold regular constituency meeting so that avenue is closed. The Commissioner's message on the town website is a 'rally the troops' kind of feel good message and doesn't allow for questions. Then there are the blogs, which feature too much anonymity and not an insignificant amount of game playing with agent provocateurs pretending to be from the other side and political insiders trying to advance insider agendas by pretending to be objective bystanders. It always makes me laugh when these same insiders complain about the blogs.
The net result is that we have no forum for communicating with our elected representatives in public. I say 'in public' because you can call or email individual board members and often get a response. But a public dialogue allows information to be shared more widely and prevents the closed door promises that can later be denied due to lack of corroborating witnesses. Faulty modes of communication result in faulty communication and that's central to perpetuating the hard feelings and misinformation that currently dominate political discussion in East Greenbush.
If the new majority wants to be understood it is incumbent upon them to find effective ways of communicating their agenda. I would recommend reinstating questions and answers during public comment but I doubt this will happen. In the absence of that they need to find a way to better communicate their message. Because until they do it will continue to seem like they don't want to be questioned, which is unfortunate because there are only 3 reasons not to answer questions: (1) you don't know the answer; (2) you're hiding something; or (3) you don't accept the right of the person to ask the question. All three are troubling and lead to some of what we're seeing right now. The simple solution is to improve communication. How that should be done is a question answered by leaders engaged in the act of open and accountable government.
Jack, So much for your objective point of view. Now your just another gadfly. A circle jerking blogger.
DeleteAnonymous 4:39: And you're just another anonymous coward who spews venom but won't sign his/her name. But thanks for the Gadfly comment. I knew that circle jerk comment would hit a nerve. I was almost disappointed but now I know you're listening. As for objectivity, I'm with sociologist Alvin Gouldner who said that objectivity is like a minotaur - half man and half bull. Everyone has a point of view and I'm proud that mine is different from yours.
ReplyDeleteJack great piece...and yes I guess I'm just another circle jerking blogger.....
ReplyDeleteThe only part I will draw to people's attention is the part about the town board getting back to people's e-mails. I haven't heard a word from any of them and I have sent the same e-mail twice to all of them, and that all of them included Mr. Gilbert too. So 6 different people got my e-mail twice and not a 1 of them responded. Maybe I should keep sending it everyday till I hear something back from them? So maybe you often get a response, but not me.
Oh yeah almost forgot this is the real Jim_C
LOL