A real legal "lap-dance" has been coming from the Casino people. Trying to bend and stretch language so as to get what they need. It seems clear from the history of the casino initiative in the State that the Legislature intended that potential casino developers would have the sense to look for land for their projects which were properly zoned and not require the cognitive gymnastics we're seeing from Capital View.
Fortunately, the issue before the ZBA was clearly addressed in the Question and Answer sessions with the developers and the Gaming Commission. The quotation below is from the transcript of those sessions. It seems clear that if the ZBA members can read English, their votes will be to deny the Capital View request. The question asked is exactly the one before the ZBA. And the Gaming Commission's answer is abundantly clear. Are we going to see some cognitive dissonance (read political wiring) on Tuesday night? Or will the ZBA follow the law?
"Q.327. Do the preemption provisions of N.Y. Racing Pari-Mutuel Wagering and Breeding Law Article 13 extend beyond the "gaming floor"? Because the statute requires at least one hotel and other facilities, it is not clear why preemption doesn't extend beyond gaming activities.
A.327. See N.Y. Racing Pari-Mutuel Wagering and Breeding
Law § 1366 and the answer to Question 184.
The preemption of local zoning
and land use under N.Y. Racing
Pari Mutuel Wagering and Breeding Law § 1366 applies only
to conduct of gaming as a permitted use or approved
activity for the Project Site. N.Y. Racing Pari-Mutuel Wagering
and Breeding Law § 1366
does not preempt local zoning and land use regulation as to non-gaming activities and permitted uses of a proposed
Gaming Facility."
To me, it's a no-brainer. Parking in a covered garage, lodging in a hotel, relaxing in a spa, shopping in a gift shop, and eating in a restaurant are NOT gaming activities. Let's face it, the developers and Keith Langley & co. blew it in the first inning of the game when they chose that site. Even if the rezoning of the property gets all the way to the town board for approval (a) it would take months that they don't have to get there because of lawsuits and (b) they don't have a super-majority of support on the TB to push it across the finish line. For those reasons alone, the location board will not pick EG as the site. You'll see.
ReplyDeleteThe history of this matter is very simple, and the issue should not even be before the ZBA. The Gaming Commission created a "confusion" in its wording of the Request for Applications. This confusion was specifically addressed in the Q & A that the Commission had with the developers. Capital View is attempting to politically manipulate the process by posing the questionable question before the ZBA. From this whole mess, you can get a pretty good idea who is writing Board Resolutions that deal with the casino issue. I'd say they get "walked in" from Saratoga and dumped on the Supervisor's desk.
ReplyDeleteBut Gadfly the law is on our side. We will prevail. The biggest project, in my view, will be getting the attorney for the people PAID IN FULL. Mr. Myer has been a Godsend but he doesn't work for free nor should he.
ReplyDeleteYou're absolutely right, Anony...... Remember in the FOIL'ed notes the developers gloated a bit that they were really in control because to oppose them would cost too much legal money. Everyone benefiting from this fight should be making a contribution to help defray our legal costs. Contributions can be made at the Save East Greenbush website at this link:
Deletehttp://saveeastgreenbush.nationbuilder.com/
If everyone who signed the anti-casino petition contributed $25, we'd be all set.
Dear Gadfly:
ReplyDeleteLet's not forget that BOTH the Chairperson and the Vice Chairperson of the ZBA have recused themselves from the vote on the "interpretation" due to "conflicts."
As a result, the people of East Greenbush will not have the benefit of having a fully constituted ZBA researching, discussing and voting on the most important Zoning issue in the history of our Town.
Sadly, you just can't make this stuff up..
Be well,
Tom
The true danger here is not how the zoning board and the town board treat this issue, but how they are able to treat all subsequent issues. If they are essentially allow to totally disregard zoning law to satisfy their own appetite, they will open the door to enabling almost anything in any district by setting a dangerous precedent. For this vote, it doesn't really matter whether a member is for or against the casino, they simply need to adhere to the law and regulations. Even someone in favor of the casino can vote no on this and state that were it in a zone that allowed these uses, they'd vote in favor, but it is the law that prohibits it, not the voting members. The real question is how much of tax payer dollars is the town willing to spend in court to defend an action that is clearly not allowed. Paying the attorney is in everyone's interest because this is to preserve the future of the town in ALL zoning districts, not just this location.
ReplyDeleteAnony 9:48 you should send your post in an e-mail to ALL voting board members. Its that good.
DeleteThank you. You are most welcome to forward it to them. I trust it is an unbiased opinion that should reflect the opinion of all, not just one side. Thanks again.
ReplyDeleteThe members of the ZBA took an oath of office to "uphold the laws of New York State and the Town of East Greenbush". They are there to look out for the interests of all the Town's residents, including parents sending a daughter to the Girl Scout Camp and families who own homes of Thompson Hill Road. All we need is one voting member of the ZBA to have the integrity to do their job and this disaster can end.
ReplyDeleteI think there is another argument which puts another nail in the coffin of the Capital View initiative with the ZBA. Given the history and notoriety of the exemption of "gaming" from local zoning laws, I believe that the Legislature would have been very explicit if it had intended to include the other "amenities" in the exemption from local zoning laws. I think Mr. West and Feathers are trying to carry water in a bucket full of holes, and they hoped we wouldn't notice.
ReplyDeleteGadfly, who else do we know who tried to carry water for the casino cause and hoped we wouldn't notice? Sue Mangold. But for savvy minded, feisty residents and Mr. Meyer, Sue would have been content to violate ethics laws and keep right on voting. This, in my view, means she can't be trusted to act in the best interests of the town, only herself and her family. This should not be forgiven or forgotten.
DeleteAs I've previously stated, Mr. West did not seem at all confident in his delivery of HIS interpretation of the law at the last ZB hearing. He seemed to be imploring the ZB to see it his way. But Mr. West can't possibly think we'd take it lying down even if the ZB errs in its interpretation of the law. They have a fight on their hands and judging by the Supervisor's demeanor at these meetings, I think he damn well knows it.
DeleteI see your point, but Sue has been working with Mary Ann on some good government initiatives - particularly on budget issues. Government has to change here in EG. I'd appreciate anyone who makes an honest effort. We'll see who the Dems and Reps put up next time around. Not hopeful right now. I think we might need a third party effort - with hands washed of everything past, with a clear platform and candidates we know can deliver on what they say. We've been through the "valley of the shadow" with the last two.
DeleteYes, if ever there was a time for a third party candidate to primary an incumbent, it's 2015. Both Dems and Repubs in this town have worn out their welcome. It's time for a change but first we need to get passed casinogate and pay the attorney...in that order!
Deletea candidate with integrity and intelligence would win in a walk
DeleteThe ZB was advised of exactly what, almost word for word, of what Anon 9:48 am wrote. Residents who attended the ZB hearing and the PB hearing have informed BOTH the ZB and the PB of that exact same thought--a number of residents have voiced that concern. The ZB is well aware of this....but will they pay attention to it???
ReplyDeleteAssssssssssssshooooooooooles. With nooooooocredibility. Donnie boy. Don't look around the corner
ReplyDeleteThis is the content of the opposition, ladies and gents. Make you proud to be an American, right?
DeleteRealizing that Keith Langley doesn't read the blog, if he did, he deserves to read some objective criticism that isn't borne out of hatred or just plain nastiness.
ReplyDeleteIf he did read, he should read that there is no shame in admitting a mistake. That he had a tremendous opportunity at the start of this new majority, but his approach was wrong. If he read here, he'd read that the fundamental mistake of his administration, was assuming that residents would be in favor of a casino and following the advice of the "powers that be", namely the Harts, Maneys, Rich Crist and Feathers, that this would be a good thing for East Greenbush. Your job was never to run things on your own, that's what a democracy is about. It's about team building and building a consensus. The fundamental mistake was NOT asking residents what they thought and thinking you and that team new better than everyone else.
Instead you were overly critical rather than cooperative. You gave orders rather than asking for help or others opinions. In the process, you and your "team" failed to evaluate the most fundamental requirements of this proposal, the zoning. Even if you could force it, you would be forcing it on an electorate that disagrees with you and as a result, lose it court. If you had asked a few people to be objective, you'd have known all this.
instead, you had your attack dog Ed Gilbert, who is as low and unethical as anyone this town has ever seen, host and almost solely write a blog that will publicly be linked to you if you are foolish enough to run. If you think every comment hasn't been printed out for campaign fliers, you're sadly mistaken. If you think there aren't people who can track the origin of the blog, wrong again. Everyone knows and it's Ed and Ed, as we all know, is you. He's your boy. You will have to suffer the fate of your contempt for those who disagree with you.
Had you simply asked questions and evaluated things on a business basis, rather than try to politicize the effort for your own benefit, you could have avoided all this consternation and be working on a financial plan to truly save this town.
You lost my vote, you lost my respect and you lost my friendship. Sad thing is I'm not alone and you don't care. This isn't to be mean. It's just the way it is. The casino deal is over in East Greenbush. Rebuilding the town is still possible, rebuilding your reputation… unfortunately you don't get a second chance at that. The answer to the question you keep asking everyone is no, you aren't electable anymore. Not because you couldn't be, but because you've offended everyone and you have no one of credibility left to support you. You failed in the most basic duty of the job, serving the people. But you should run, I encourage you to run. Seriously! Put your name on the ballot again and run with everything you've got. You need to see who will work for you, raise money for you, walk petitions for you and most of all vote for you. The only way you can possibly humble an ego like yours is to suffer a very public defeat, which you will. And you don't need to believe an anonymous post… ask Rick McCabe.
Gadfly, this is great to see because they're showing their hand. If things were going so well for them, they wouldn't care what you're saying or doing. The casino project is obviously on shakey ground and they know it. From a zoning perspective alone, they don't have a leg to stand on. Let the angry outbursts keep coming. Before long now we will have won the fight and they will be fighting for their political lives.
ReplyDelete8:57 p.m. That is the best post I have ever read. I'm reading it over and over because it encapsulates exactly how I feel as well about Keith Langley. I thought I was backing a winner but I was wrong. He's an incorrigible child. He goes out of his way to do everything wrong, then he asks people over and over "do you think I'm re-electable?" But what's he's really doing is testing you and daring you to tell him what he already knows, which is that not only is he NOT re-electable, he should resign and get help. What a shame. It took 14 years to get the reigns, and two years to lose them.
ReplyDeleteKeith, you attended the last committee meeting and acted mean and insecure. You're well known for attacking your own but you make deals with Junior? It's all over town how you're going down. You are the personification of pride goeth before a fall. You should have listened to people who are smarter than you, not dumber. The most successful people surround themselves with people who are smarter and more talented than they are. Haven't you ever heard two (or more) heads are better than one? Apparently not. Get with it, man, before it's too late.
ReplyDeleteHere is TU Chris Churchill's read on the odds of CVC&R getting a license to operate in EG.
ReplyDeleteCapital View Casino and Resort
This proposal by Saratoga Harness Racing and Churchill Downs is for East Greenbush land surrounded by a residential neighborhood, a Montessori school and a Girl Scout camp. Could a site get any more perfect?
Cons: The residential neighborhood, Montessori school and a Girl Scout camp. There is also that pesky opposition group whose members stubbornly refuse to pipe down. Actually, if the state chooses Capital View when speaker after speaker condemned it, the public hearings were a sham.
Pros: There must be a compelling reason why this relatively affluent town should benefit from a gambling expansion designed to help distressed communities. And that reason is ... Um, I'm going to need some help with this one. Anybody? Anybody? Hello?
Likelihood: Dead in the water.
When it comes to square pegs and round holes, man does this project fit the description.
ReplyDeleteIf you were to make a couple of logical assumptions, the decision becomes almost very clear. First, let's assume that the State will in fact issue a license to one capital region project. let's also assume that the casino industry has a questionable future that will likely benefit the most sound projects with the best business plan and financial backing.
Based on those two assumptions which are not crazy, there is a high risk of failure for the wrong project in the capital region. two licenses down state will hinder traffic to the capital region so our pool of visitors is limited. Howe Caves is the sentimental favorite for many people, but the reality is there is low traffic volume there and the mixture of adult and family entertainment didn't go so well for Vegas. Plus financing is going to be an issue there.
Saratoga has a number of cons it is facing especially local opposition, even if Ed and Rita cox ignore it, but what may be more significant is the potential for a white elephant in a residential neighborhood if the casino fails. Not to mention the most assured court battle to overcome the zoning which may not be settled by the time the decision is made. Churchill may have had that one right.
Schenectady and Rensselaer seem to be the most logical; however, when you talk about potential failure in the casino industry, the only project that may have a sustainable future, even if the casino fails in five years, is Hard Rock. They have stand alone hotels and can come up with an adaptive reuse for the site to complement the hotel on the river with shops, dining whatever.
The mistake here is not going after a plan that has potential to help the town, it's far more basic than that. It's not having the best plan. Had Saratoga invested in a site in a commercial zone in East Greenbush, or in the industrial zone down near the river, we may not be having this conversation, because it would at least be in an appropriate zone.
Someone either made bad, wrong or premature assumptions early on and thought they could push this through. The opposition isn't wrong to oppose anything in an incompatible zone. But to grant this project on that site, would mean the eventual rezoning of the entire ridge and instead of being a shining city on the hill… we'd be a city shining on the hill.
Hearts (no pun intended) may have been in the right place, but the thought process and execution was dramatically flawed. Cognitive Dissonance indeed!
If anyone thinks back to Keith Langley's campaign days, they will recall people showing up to campaign for him, put fliers together, knock on doors and participate in blitzes for him. And he didn't thank those people. He spent the time standing in one area of Chris Defruscio's car lot, on his cell phone while volunteers for HIM were putting the campaign material together, mapping out the blitz route and walking neighborhoods for him. Those absent thank you's were noticed. There are a few regular commenters on this blog that can vouch for that. It was rude, arrogant and disappointing. Keith's deplorable behavior did not rear its ugly head when he won the majority. It showed up during his campaign and THAT was the first sign of his true character---strike 1. Then he wins office and disallows questions from the public during Town Board meetings--strike 2. Then he appoints his buddies and cohorts to paid positions in Town Hall---strike 3. Keith's second time at the plate he votes against a resolution allowing the public to speak at ALL public meetings, not simply the Town Board meetings---strike 1 again. Then he continues to refuse to disclose the audit results---strike 2. THEN the casino resolution comes up---strike 3. Keith has been prohibiting people from associating and speaking with some residents in this Town since BEFORE he actually stepped into the office January 2013. He has been dictating who can be friends with whom and who can talk to whom and who is involved with whom and the list goes on and on since December 2012 when he was choosing who he would want to bring into jobs. All of that was LONG before the casino and before he had a majority.
ReplyDeleteKeith self destructed long before the casino resolution and his complete show of disrespect for Town residents that opposed it. Even the Gaming Commission asked Ed Gilbert why the residents were not allowed input. Some of us simply caught on quicker than others. Some of us saw it during his campaign and some of us saw it when he appointed his friends to Town positions and some of us did not see it until the casino debacle but now everyone sees it.
But you're right Keith---take another crack at it and see how many show up again this time.
How they thought they could get this casino project through in that location is beyond me. Were they high on drugs or did they just think they could sneak it, ram it, or litigate it through? Who are these people and how could they have such bad market researchers on their payroll? It's truly bizzare but, like 911, let's never forget what Keith Langley did and tried to do to our town in 2014.
ReplyDeleteNO LANGLEY 2015
10/14 @ 3:03--Not fond of the Rensselaer site either. It's too close to EG and our property values but there is nothing we can do about Rensselaer.
ReplyDeleteI'm not saying this to be mean or a wise guy but Keith Langley has the mindset of a dictator. He thinks that he's some kind of a celebrity because he's the town Supervisor but when he got the majority the power of it went right to his head. He now truly believes that people should be lining up to serve him, that they should feel privileged to serve him, and that he owes them nothing in return. If you're going to prosper from his administration, you have to spend money, not time, money. If all you have is time, he will make promises but not deliver. Those who got jobs spent money or kissed up to him big-time for the smaller jobs. He loves anyone who kisses up to him, which is why he keeps Ed around. Ed knows how to kiss up. Ed and Keith actually have a lot in common. When Crist, Jimmy Feathers and other big name Dems in casinogate knocked on Keith's door, he probably thought he died and went to heaven. He probably finally felt like a somebody. Only now it seems apparent that all those big name players are going to walk away and leave poor Keith holding the poop bag. He always suspected it would happen anyway but it didn't stop him from gambling on it anyway. Let's see how many people are lining up to help him get re-elected next year. Even Chris will be able to count that high.
ReplyDeleteThis town government is pathetic!! Tonight was a travesty. I hope everyone shows up tomorrow night. Please open up your wallets because this fight MUST go on!
ReplyDeleteWhat were the microphones for, Tom??? Announce a Public Hearing, rent the Legion Hall, put up microphones and then say there will be no public comment??
ReplyDeleteWe need a new administration and some new boards. And by the way, did the ZBA attorney paid for by tax payers happen to brief the ZBA on the applicable law? Didn't sound like it from the questions coming from Board members. I was better prepared on the law than they were, and I didn't get to speak.
This town government is an absolute disaster. Handed the control over to Feathers and off to a vacation. Are we going to be a company town?
ReplyDeleteNone of the supporters of this sham should be supported in any way this is such a joke looking from the outside. Spend your money in places where non of these people have an stake
ReplyDeleteEast Greenbush clearly runs a government of lemmings! Saratoga didn't want it and clearly this just shows that one city's garbage is another town's "fool's gold!" Feathers found his suckers in EG! Who wants to live in a town where zoning means nothing and doesn't protect it's residents? Not I...
ReplyDeleteAnswer to q.184 is very important because they clearly define what they mean by gaming facility. Where the did the ZBA obtain their definition from that was stated tonight? Answer to q.184 by the gaming commission: "N.Y. Racing, Pari-Mutuel Wagering and Breeding Law § 1366 operates as a complete preemption of local zoning only with respect to the conduct of gaming, which is defined in §1301.20 as “dealing, operating, carrying on, conducting, maintaining or exposing for pay of any game.”
ReplyDelete§1309.2 does not preempt local zoning or land-use laws, other than as set
forth in § 1366. The applicant is required to identify any required
rezoning, variances, land use approvals, local permits, or special use
permits and a schedule pertaining to their acquisition for any use or
activity that does not constitute gaming, e.g. drainage and storm water,
traffic circulation, etc."
The foundations for an entirely new administration were laid on Tuesday night. What we saw was another episode in imperialism. An un-educated ZBA which should have been educated in the applicable law. Absolutely disgusting.
ReplyDeleteFeathers needs a "company town." He landed here because this administration is dumb enough to try to give him one.
DeleteLast night was disappointing but not surprising. This town has been run on a philosophy of "anybody can do it" so we have people on every board who are simply not qualified to be there. No attention is paid to the technical details of anything, be it the town's finances, the siting of a casino, or as with last night's decision, the letter of the law. The only qualifications are who you know and what you have contributed to the political campaigns and careers of a handful of insiders. This approach had put the town in a deep hole but that was nothing compared to what happened when a group of corporate predators allied with a few local businessmen set their sights on what was left of East Greenbush. The quality of our elected and appointed officials left us defenseless.
ReplyDeleteLast night a question was raised about the definition of the word 'resident.' It reminded me of Bill Clinton saying "Well it depends on what your definition of the word 'is' is." One member even asked whether the term 'resident' could apply to patrons gambling in the casino. The flailing about by members to justify their votes was terrifying. It had the intellectual substance of a bad reality show. And just like a bad reality show, the 'actors' didn't understand the train wreck caused by their own cluelessness. Only this wasn't entertainment, it was the quality of our lives that was being consumed.
'Defenseless,' 'clueless,' 'unqualified'? Using these words to describe other people doesn't come easy for me but I've really had enough of this garbage. Even if we're not selected for a casino the carnage is mounting. Last night we threw the entire zoning ordinance on the fire and watched it burn. Add that to the loss of credibility of our town officials and an embittered community and you wonder if there's any limit to the price these people are willing to make us pay to get what they want.
Jack, I wish I could speak as eloquently as you, you said it perfect! I was expecting a unanimous vote last night, yet I left I think more disappointed than I have been in the last 6 months. I'm not sure if it is a build up of the ridiculousness that continues, or if it was that I expected the ZBA to have at least a legit, educated reason to vote they way they did. Instead, I couldn't even understand them half the time because I don't think they knew what they were even saying at times. The lack of competence and confidence was scary. Our town needs to clean house, if only it were that easy. This just gets uglier and more disappointing. Very disappointed with 4 members of the ZBA. They didn't need to interpret the law, the Gaming Commission has answered this interpretation question several times. Instead, they did what they were told to do, Tom Calamaras said so himself!
DeleteJack and Bonnie K, sorry I wasn't there the other night, been very busy lately.
DeleteThis has become par for the course with this town. A few insiders reaping the benefits while the rest of us are left with nothing. Nothing surprises me anymore in this town. They just do as they are instructed to do, never any good reason just do what they are told.
Gadfly, I read this disturbing quote in the TU.
ReplyDelete"Acting Chairman Tom Calamaras voted in favor of it.
“We did what we were asked to do by the town,” he said. “Plain and simple.”
Who is "the town" and who asked him to do anything? I CAN'T BELIEVE HE SAID THAT! The ZBA is supposed to be an independent board acting on the merits of the law. This whole process is fixed but it will be over when the location board awards another site the license.
Jack, everyone needs to calm down. Your post is dead on, as usual, nothing you said is incorrect but let's not give these jokers more power than they actually have. They voted last night to change the law to accommodate this project but the ZBA by itself doesn't have the power to change the law. Only the town board has the power to change the law in this instance but WITH a perfected 265 petition and WITHOUT a super-majority of yes votes, they can't git 'er done. As they say, Jack, it's not over 'til it's over. Save your strength, man. There's more to come.
ReplyDeleteWhen I need a good laugh and break from the craziness, I just rewatch the video of Ed Gilbert making a fool of himself. Thank God for technology!
DeleteAnonymous 10:06:
ReplyDeleteI did take a deep breath after reading your comment and it felt good. The law wasn't changed last night but a precedent was set. If I wanted to squeeze something where it didn't fit I'd get a good lawyer, cite this precedent and make it happen. I do hear you about conserving my strength and I love the Yogi quote. I stand by what I wrote but yours is an important caveat. As my son likes to say 'good looking out.'
Seems clear that the members of the ZBA had really not asked the most elementary questions about what it was that they were doing. In effect they "deemed" the commercial activities like restaurants, hotels, parking garages and stores to have the same exemption from local zoning regulation as gaming enjoys via state law. This is exactly the opposite of what the Gaming Commission stated in answer to the same question. Talk about suspending the intellect!!
ReplyDeleteCapital View's request is based on language in the Request for Applications by the Gaming Commission. The Gaming Commission clarified its position in the Q & A with the developers. But could it be that the Legislature intended such a change in public policy? NO! Yesterday I visited the State Archives to read the material in the Bill Jacket for Chapter 174 of the Laws of 2013 - the enabling legislation for the casino initiative. These materials are often consulted by the courts to determine questions of legislative intent. I can tell you that there is absolutely no material there that would support any contention that the legislature intended to exempt the "amenities" connected with gaming from the controls of local zoning. So Capital View advanced a fallacious argument and the ZBA fell for it - because they were doing what the Town asked them to do. Good grief.
Land use master plans and zoning laws are supposed to be there to provide community stability and to protect the long-term investments that citizens make, like buying a house. We need people on boards who are capable of more than the most superficial thought.
People aren't picked for boards for their intellect, they are picked to support the goals of the majority, in this case, Keith Langley. Anyone who thinks these boards are there to think independently or do the right thing is just fooling him or herself. That's what lawyers are for. They make right the wrongs of the selfish, the irresponsible, and the greedy people who dominate politics everywhere.
ReplyDeleteHere is the true travesty about last night. This has nothing to do with a casino in East Greenbush. Feathers is happy to rip this town apart and pit neighbor against neighbor with the promise of big benefits to the town that will never come. The problem is, this isn't for EG, it's for Feathers. His deal with Churchill Downs is likely contingent upon getting the license here in East Greenbush. Then Churchill gets to enter the lucrative NY market without paying big fees to the state. Feathers sells out his half of SRC and we all pay the price for having something that should have never been built in an area where it was never intended to be built. There is zero economic benefit to East Greenbush except some money to help pay for the trouble it brings. Feathers and Hart and Maney and everyone they've dipped into helping them get their piece and they sold out their town to do it. Problem is, we have to endure the headaches to prove to everyone else we are right. Once it's done, it's done. Feathers won't even have a controlling interest when this is all said and done. He's using this town to get what he wants and will spend whatever it takes, because it's worth it!
ReplyDeleteThe zoning board didn't vote for the casino. They offered up an arbitrary and capricious argument for every project to come after this. When people on the hill can't sell their homes, one by one, they will be rezoned commercial. Say goodbye to the scenic views EG residents noted as a priority to them in the zoning study.
ReplyDeletePeople continue to talk as if a casino IS coming to EG, which is very probably not so. We must not underestimate the powerful effect the opposition has had on this project. It got one board member to look closer at the project and withdraw her support. It got other board members to recuse themselves. It got an entire town of sleepy residents to wake up, take notice, and get involved! It got the attention of the state's facility location board and the media. It has dominated the political landscape of this project. It has been a continuous thorn in the paw of the developer. No other city or town has experienced the level of opposition stirred up in EG. It will very likely bring Supervisor Langley down in 2015. After the license is awarded, Gov Cuomo wants it to go smoothly right up to opening day. He wants opening day to be a celebration not ruined by bitterly angry, sign waving, screaming locals who will strive to make patrons of the casino feel unwelcome in our town until they close the casino down! Therefore, the chances of the casino coming to EG are, I believe, as Chris Churchill said, "dead in the water." Keep up the good work, EG!
ReplyDeleteLittle has been hears from rosewood gardens , How do people who have residents there feel ? I wouldn't want anyone I cared about having this thing so close
ReplyDeleteThere's and easy way to send a letter to the Gaming Commission opposing the siting of a casino in East Greenbush. Just go to the link below, sign up, fill in your information and hit submit.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.saveeastgreenbush.com/contact.html
Ed Gilbert's Mea Culpa from the EGMatters blog.....
ReplyDelete"After a long discussion with a few people whose opinions I respect and value I was forced to admit to them and myself that my statement to the citing Board was incorrect and yes at times mean spirited. In my speech I said “ I would like to point out that this familiar group of activists has a long history of challenging development projects, from Fed Ex to Home Depot”. I should have said that “these types of activist “ obviously there are very few people (if any) that are challenging the casino that challenged the Chip Fab plant or Fed Ex also I couldn’t name any opposition to Home Depot. Additionally I was assured by them that the grass roots effort is strictly local and they have no “ new found friends from around the state” If anyone else had stated this to me I would listen but still retain a healthy amount of skepticism. It is only because of my history in knowing these people and the level of their integrity I believe this now to be true.
I know many of you are upset with me for varying reasons and I am willing to listen to your criticisms and respond to them as best I can. I apologize to all of you who I unfairly characterized in my speech. It was not something I’m proud of and I will endeavor to improve. My sincerest apologies to all.
Note to the editors of this blog. While this blog is simply exercising its first amendment rights it is now being attributed to myself and others. This is not the face we want for the public. Much good has been accomplished by this administration and we would prefer to concentrate in the positive then wallow in the mud with the likes of the other blogs in the community. I am asking that you help us in this regard by taking down the old and starting anew with a positive message. My hope is that if you are really on our side you will accept this request.
Ed Gilbert"
Ed, your Penance is to convince your cronies to tell Feathers and Company to go away and never bother this community again.
DeleteEd and his blog buddies took it down on advice of counsel. They were hearing the footsteps getting closer and closer. Let's see what they come up with next. "The Keith Langley is Very Smart" blog, perhaps?
DeleteBut 5:56 p.m. they're fooling themselves if they thing the footsteps won't keep coming just because they took it down. The footprints on the internet can never be fully erased, right? At least that's what I've heard.
DeleteSword:
ReplyDeleteMr. Gilbert is trying to put the toothpaste back into the tube. Only time will tell how sincere he is. Ed Gilbert has had an awful lot of negative, personal and dishonest things to say about a whole lot of us over the last year.
Let's see if his future actions speak louder than his insulting words.
One immediate positive step he should take is resign from his position on the Ethics Board at tonight's scheduled Ethics Board meeting at 7pm in Town Hall.
@ 4:55 PM-
ReplyDeleteAs long as Ed Gilbert remains as a member of the Ethics Board, his apology is practically meaningless. Show us you really mean it Ed and get off that important Board now.
I am outraged by Mr. Gilbert's post. He and others of his ilk are responsible for the EGMatters blog but now he has the audacity to blame it on, well, WHO? Does he think he can get off the hook, on which he put himself, by appealing to some unknown entity to take down HIS blog? Very clever, Ed. If you're not responsible for the EGMatters blog, then produce the one who is! If you can't do it, then it's YOU! It will always be you until you can prove otherwise. Your apology is as phony and insincere as Langley's attempt to be a human being on board night. 2015 is an election year and you're ALL trying to SAVE your rotten necks. It won't work. We saw you talking to the Jenkins last night. Too little, too late, EJ. You will always be known as a mean one, Eddie G. No matter what you say or do you stink, stank, stunk! Resign now!
ReplyDeleteIf Gilbert thinks he fooled anybody trying to blame others for his blog he even dumber than I thought. How insulting. All of these idiots have got to go!
ReplyDeleteToo little too late....
ReplyDeleteThe bizarre attitudes toward what governing was existed before the casino fiasco appeared, but they escalated after the plot matured. What Langley, DeFruscio, Gilbert, Crist, Jimino and the rest have done to this community needs to be paid for by more that a "they made me do it" blog comment. They need to stop the disaster which they helped to create with the goons from Saratoga who promised "gold." Last night, Langley denied conspiring to subvert the Open Meetings Law. It's in the FOIL'ed notes that they consulted the Town Attorney in this regard. Gilbert was not the guiding light, but he was a water carrier for the effort.
ReplyDeleteTime to make amends for doing this by doing something constructive for this community. In my view, and I think the view of the vast majority of the citizens of this Town, the constructive move would be to STOP the casino initiative. Stop taking direction from Saratoga. Tell Feathers and his friends on the Hill that it's OVER.
You took all that stuff down from the blog. Isn't this about the second or third time that you people have done something like that? It doesn't go away. What you have done to this community will not go away with an "eraser." As the Sword said, there's some Penance to be done.
Ed Gilbert is responsible for the EGM blog but the fact is that he doesn't make a move without Keith Langley's say so. It's fair to blame Gilbert because he IS the blog administrator but Langley and Chris DeFruscio don't get a pass. They are a team of bullies so they get to take the blame together no matter how much they deny their involvement. We must hold our elected officials just as accountable for their actions as we do for their inactions. Bullying has no place in the workforce or in our town. Until the three of them take ownership of the EGM blog and apologize for it, what they did should not be forgiven or forgotten.
ReplyDeleteAt the board meeting last night, Supr. Langley was gushing all over Maura Ryan as if he's been in favor of the CFAC all along (not!) Too bad it took 10 months to get the CFAC back up and running because Langley was so opposed to it he wouldn't support it. CP Malone broke the ice by appointing Andrea Smith, which the majority tried and failed to vote down. CP Matters then broke ranks with Langley on this issue and appointed Michelle LeClair. Then came CP Mangold's appointment of Rich Hendricks and then CP DiMartino reaffirmed Maura Ryan. Langley was dead last to make his appointment, but not publicly, who wound up being non other than Sean Mulvey (hmmm). Regardless, the committee is strong and is already proving its worth. CP Matters said at the board meeting last night, as Langley continued to gush over Maura, "To bad it took 10 months to get the CFAC up and running again. It would have saved George (Phillips) a lot of time and effort putting the pieces of the financial puzzle in place." Langley said, "He didn't spend that much time doing that, did you, George?" And George, bless his soul, said "Yes, I did." It's been nothing but a tug of war since January to get this supervisor to do things right. The only question left to ask is, how much more can we take?
ReplyDeleteLet us NEVER forget that every move that Mr. Langley had made has been directed by Mr. DeFruscio. Somebody made the comment above someplace that the smartest thing the Rep Committee could do for some semblance of survival would be to "loose" DeFruscio. Mr. Langley has no political or governing instinct of his own. He's taken direction, but from the wrong people.
DeleteIn that job, we need a person of integrity and intelligence, not beholden to a ""party" agenda, but loyal to the interests of the public. This translates to transparency in government, timely audits, tax cuts, workload analysis and no patronage or nepotism. Really a simple way to go. Just takes the will of the electorate.
For someone as intelligent as Ed Gilbert, the statement is very poorly written. It reads as if it was ordered (dictated?) by Langley himself in order to put something (anything?) up on their blog to provide them some cover for shutting it down (again). Is this an example of Keith Langley in campaign mode? If so, he'd better get an editor and proofreader on his staff ASAP.
ReplyDeleteI could be wrong, but I didn't see anything in the Gilbert statement wherein he denied being a major contributor to the vile blog.
ReplyDeleteYes, carefully worded indeed.
DeleteYES! 7:36 p.m. that's exactly what it is. Ed is Keith's boy and Ed does what he's told to do. Perhaps the heat at the board meeting last night was turned up a little too high for the Supe's liking. Perhaps too many residents demanded Ed's resignation. Perhaps he's trying to repair his majority as we approach budget season. And, most of all, perhaps campaign 2015 is starting now. CASINOGATE alone makes it necessary for the Supe to start kissing babies now. It's all very telling. I say NO LANGLEY 2015 or ever again!
ReplyDeleteEd, you have betrayed the citizens of EG. Nice little letter you wrote to the demeaning blog. Requesting them to be POSITIVE and they change overnight at your request. I agree with others here that YOU OWN IT, until you tell everyone the name(s) of it's administrators. You are at least guilty by association. Hanging out with bad people has a way of corrupting an individual. I believe you have disqualified yourself from any appointed office in town by your actions.
ReplyDeleteBonnie L. - your post says it best...perfect.
DeleteI left a comment as invited on the EGMatters blog. But they don't seem to be able to publish. Bet there is a conference going on in the truck.
ReplyDeleteEd, "while this blog is simply exercising its first amendment rights?" Is it really that "simple," Ed, when for months your blog has been brutally trashing and humiliating Councilperson Matters and many other people in our town in the most personal and infantile way possible? Do you really think you can make it go away by stating "much good has been accomplished?" What "good" are you talking about, Ed? Mary Ann Matters was a member of your boss's majority, of the "team" DeFruscio loves to reference, but you send her (a board member!) a 'play ball or else' message anyway (yes, Ed, we believe that you did that) and then when she calls you on it you create a smear blog to trash the living daylights out of her, her husband, her associates AND her friends? Are you, Langley and DeFruscio off your rockers? Did you really think that tactic would do any of you any good? You're plain and simply idiots who don't deserve the mantle of power and our town is in crisis with Langley at the helm. You chased a member of your majority away. It's clear that she has experienced her independence now on this board and that that won't change. Hopefully, the only thing that will change, Ed, is the name on your boss's door on 1/1/15.
ReplyDeleteLet's not get too distracted over a childish blog. While I do find the blog an important discussion topic when taking down those involved and a reminder of how ridiculous some "adults" in our town are, let's not get distracted by the bigger picture. Whether Ed is sincere or not and whether Ed is the administrator of that blog means nothing at this point. He has publicly put his foot in his mouth one too many times. The Times Union even shut down his blog. All this new blog is is a reminder of how childish players in our town are, most importantly those controlling Langley. Ed's role in the game is just annoying us by speaking, he has no power. So let's not focus our energy on him but the bigger picture - LANGLEY!
ReplyDeleteAmazing how Ed could get through to post on the blog when I'm sure many others have tried but denied approval to post to it. He's just trying to make it look like he has some control left over whoever is writing the blog or as the voice of reason. He isn't fooling anybody. Someone probably told him he isn't helping the casino initiative. He's one of the only people in EG who has had an ax to grind about Mary Ann Matters over the last few months and it all started right after she withdrew her support for the casino. Hopefully, someone was smart enough to take screenshots and printed out what was being said on the blog. If the casino supporters were behind Gilbert and Langley all the way and believed in them, they would've showed up for the board meetings, planning board meetings and the public hearings in herds. They would've made intelligent arguments or showed camaraderie especially at the public hearing last month. But they didn't. When the casino doesn't come, the supporters will turn their backs on Gilbert and Langley too, but they'll blame the opposition because they won't be able to face the facts that this whole thing was wrong from the start. Ed, we know it's you. You'll probably throw in a couple of irate or disgruntled comments from other posters to try to cause doubt who "the Admin" really is. Good luck trying to put the spin on things just before the decision is made in November. We won't forget this next November. As a parting gift, we'll send you some Girl Scout cookies since you do seem to like to "Tag-a-long" and "Do-si-do!"
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed Ed Gilbert's letter to himself. It's a good start. Now let's have the apology to Mary Ann Matters. I never thought I would see someone treated worse than Ann Taylor on a town blog but what those people did to Mary Ann was a new low. Of course, they also threw in as many insults at Ann as they could just for good measure. They can write as many letters of contrition as they'd like but they can't erase what's been done. The fact that the people who ran that blog also run this town tells you why things are the way they are.
ReplyDeleteI think it's time for EG Talks and EG Matters to openly state who is moderating those blogs. I'm not a big fan of anonymous blogging but I've come to accept that it's here to stay but there's no excuse for an anonymous blog. Every one knows who runs the Gadfly. Don Johnson has been insulted, threatened and slandered for his efforts but because he has the courage of his convictions he keeps on trucking. We all owe him a debt of gratitude for his work here. Compare that to the masked men who run the other blogs. The best threads on Talks are the ones written and signed by Pete Stenson. I do appreciate that they let me participate in their conversation but I would love to see them come out of the shadows, particularly with an election next year.
I think Mary Ann Matters has done a great job of maintaining her composure in the face of the vile campaign waged against her by Ed Gilbert and company. She deserves a ton of credit. I'm sorry she had to go through that but, of course, I'm not the one who owes her an apology. Ed?
Well if it wass Ed, he's really not that bright. If he reallly was against this blog (there was no gray area on that blog, just horrendous, childish comments) he wouldn't be asking them to be on their "side." If it is Ed, your apology is an insult. You dont try to apologize while insulting. You bash "other" blogs, you promote "sides" when you should be promoting unity. Most importantly, why would you read such a horrendous blog and ask them to be on your side...those comments represent those you want to associate with?
ReplyDeleteThere are a few things important to note at this time. First, Ed Gilbert's letter is of little consequence. Ed is not elected, he was appointed by Keith Langley. Keith owns the blog and every comment that was posted on it. Even Chris DeFruscio, for all the credit he gets for being the mastermind of the party, is no mastermind. He may have helped get a new majority, but at the end of the day folks, Keith Langley calls ALL the shots. In HIS administration, it's his way or no way, even for Chris. Keith is responsible, because at any point he could have condemned that vile blog because it obviously supported him. He didn't. Ed ran it at Keith's pleasure and Keith very likely contributed to it or at the very least, dictated what should be posted from time to time.
ReplyDeleteSecond, what fools. Everyone knows that Mike Condo was involved in setting up talks. He did it to earn himself the deputy chief position and it worked. If Ed thinks that people with close ties to the state or local police departments can't trace an IP address, both he and Langley are mistaken, especially when they were openly bashing Sue Mangold, talks person.
Third, every post that's been written on that blog has been printed out by several different people. Revenge being a dish best served cold will in fact be served cold. Keith Langley has earned himself a primary battle for the republican endorsement next year and a serious opponent if he wins that. His road to keep his job is very long indeed and will haunted by the writings of Ed Gilbert, HIS deputy Supervisor.
Fourth, and I think this is very important to NOT miss this point folks, Ed didn't apologize for the blog for one simple reason… he isn't sorry. Their combined egos can not be controlled by anyone in the party. If that were possible, they would have condemned the blog the day it was linked to them AND his letter would have been submitted to both Talks and Gadfly as well, they were the ones who outed him.
More importantly, these people with whom Ed has spoken, for whom he has great respect are not people in the party. Certainly Keith never told him to take the blog down and he wouldn't listen to any one from the county. No, Ed was TOLD to take down the blog by none other than Mr. Feathers and his associates. They can not garner a casino license with the swirl of impropriety that surrounds this town, that blog and the leaders here. They believe that taking the blog down will quiet the opposition, which oddly enough, had their flame fanned by Ed himself.
Ed's letter to his own blog constitutes a private apology for a public disgrace. A response to the letter in last week's advertiser would have been far more appropriate. The only thing his letter proves is that he was obviously aware of the blog for some time. Why they ever let it persist to bash one of their own, if it wasn't their blog, remains a mystery. They created a hostile environment that Saratoga Raceway is also now associated with and they were the only ones who could entice him to take the blog down. Ed is impressed with outside money and has no interest in protecting the rights of the people he was supposed to serve.
Remember, his blog surfaced right after CP Matters changed her position. The entire blog was Saratoga raceway and casino issue motivated. Shame on them all
Dear 11:56 p.m. - Yours is the most riveting read on this situation that I have seen to date. I read the whole thing with interest right down to the last sentence. Indeed, shame on them all. If you don't mind my asking, what is your read on WHY Supervisor Langley went after a member of his own majority so viciously when he still had four solid votes for the casino? It makes no sense.
DeleteI cannot believe that Ed Gilbert is still Deputy Supervisor, and Chairman of the Ethics committee. By allowing Gilbert to remain in either and both of these positions, Langley is condoning his behavior. It is that simple.
ReplyDeleteThe most important line in his self-promotion is this one:
"Much good has been accomplished by this administration and we would prefer to concentrate in the positive then wallow in the mud with the likes of the other blogs in the community"
Mr. Gilbert cannot miss an opportunity to be snide and he does not even realize that he is doing it because it is so ingrained into his personality. A tiger does not change its stripes. People see Gilbert for who he is now, and they won't stand for it anymore. If he, or Langley think this pathetic attempt at redemption will erase the past then they continue to exhibit their ignorance.
Gilbert:
Tell the public who administers the blog.
Tell the public who wrote your speech for the Gaming Commission.
And then, please resign.
I believe in redemption and rebirth. Being redeemed is hard work. Ed's letter to himself, while intersting, does not cover one of the basics: take responsibility for your behavior. Ed needs to admit his role in the blog, apologize to Mary Ann, and make a positive contribution with his blog in the future.Then, with the passage of time, Ed will be redeemed.
ReplyDeleteWe, the citizens, have a responsibility. We need to remember that Ed is a guy who follows Keith Langley. Ed Gilbert is made possible Keith Langley. The town's suffering at the hand of Ed Gilbert could end tomorrow if Keith Langley wanted it to be so.
Dear Ed:
ReplyDeleteWhy don't you start the reinvention of the Langley administration by:
1.) Putting out the audit results or whatever you have from the auditors.
2.) Put out your list of what you claim are the positive things the Langley administration has achieved.
3.) Confirm or deny that you and DeFruscio are or were the administrators of the EGMatters blog.
4.) Provide a detailed accounting of the 2014 Organizational meeting changes.
5.) Apologize personally to Don Johnson.
There's more but start your rehabilitation of your, Langley and DeFruscio's miss steps with these simple steps.
You have been, regrettably, a jerk. You need to do a LOT more to start re-gaining your credibility. A LOT, LOT more.
Dear 11:56--interesting but your explanation does not explain why Ed and Keith went after private citizens. Ann Taylor was crucified on Ed's blog, he a whole post striking at her life and then continued with snarky comments about her in following posts. Don Johnson was shredded, even Jack took a few hits.
ReplyDeleteMary Ann was lambasted which was horrible but that's politics. She defied the majority and Ed is a part of that majority. But the others, why would Ed hit them? If your theories are correct and some I read with speculative interest, why target private citizens in such a cruel and harsh manner?
BTW--your first paragraph grants a pass to Chris Defruscio--can't happen. Chris is a grown man. Keith cannot be blamed for anything another adult does. At some point, an adult man has to take responsibility for his own actions OR his own inaction. To follow means one is complicit and for that Chris does not deserve a pass. If you are a friend of his you should share that with him.
Why they let that blog persist to bash private citizens whose votes they depend on is more of a mystery then why they let it persist to bash a CP whose withdraw of support they resented. To persecute a fellow CP and politician that disagrees with your views is one thing but to use the pen (keyboard) to verbally draw and quarter private citizens and to do it for such a long time is a larger mystery especially when it is their support and votes needed in the next election.
One big problem in EG is the Town holds too many boys and not enough men. Many of our TB members have been crying for the past few years that they didn't know, weren't told, it's always been done this way, blah, blah, blah. If one Town Board member would have the guts to stand up and say the truth, "I WASN'T PAYING ATTENTION! I was absorbed in my own self inflated ego and wasn't watching out for the taxpayers and residents," that would be a tremendous start to repairing this Town. The previous Town Boards left us with a financial mess and the current Town Board's only answer to it is a casino. Honest to God. I blame the past administrations as well as the current. The past Board members were so caught up in saying, "I'm a TB member," it is a 24 square mile Town, get over yourselves! Because the previous Board's past tax increases and didn't pay attention to where that money went and didn't pay attention to interfund borrowing,
ReplyDeletethe current Town Board sees a casino and rubber stamps it. A casino is not the band aid for our previous Board's financial errors and negligence. A financial recovery plan is the answer and the sooner the Supervisor sees that and admit that, the better off we will all be. Enough of the nonsense. Do your jobs and that includes fixing the financial mess that the previous Board's left us with. Put your head down and do your jobs and stop staring at the casino on the Hill that is not coming here.
Dear Gadfly:
ReplyDeletePlease allow me the opportunity to extend a vote of confidence and a note of thanks to our Town Comptroller, George Phillips. The "unique" character of what passes for responsible governance under the Langley administration presents a great challenge for any Town employee attempting to serve the residents and taxpayers of East Greenbush, but none more so than the position of Town Comptroller.
After a somewhat rocky start, Mr. Phillips has worked hard to familiarize himself with and listen to the concerns of those inside and most importantly, outside of Town Hall.
I was particularly impressed with his willingness to take the time to talk with a large number of people after last Wednesday Night's Town Board meeting. Though the hour was late, Mr. Phillips did not rush down the hall to his office or out the front door of Town Hall. Instead, he graciously made himself available to all and responded to questions and comments with civility and respect.
Be well,
Tom
Chris DeFruscio does not get a pass on anything. He simply can't control Langley so he goes along. He might offer different advice, but ultimately, Keith makes the call. Chris goes along with him to their mutual detriment.
ReplyDeleteAs to why go after private people, it's simple. Keith Langley will not accept responsibility for his own missteps. Ed Gilbert went after Maryann Matters because she made an independent decision to oppose the altered casino plan. She has every right. They wanted a united board under his majority to take credit for the casino saving East Greenbush.
Keith blames the opposition and the reform group for influencing Maryann as if she doesn't have the intellect to re-evaluate things for herself, which by the way she has done so far more astutely than the rest of the board.
No Ed went after private citizens because it couldn't be that Maryann acted on her own. In their opinion she HAD to be swayed by Don or Jack or Ann or Mike or someone other than her drawing her own conclusion. They chastise what they can't control. It's difficult for a casino to succeed where there is controversy. That blog was controversy and now that it can be linked to Ed though an IP address and he posted his letter he has an new problem. The better move was for it to quietly disappear and he could have sent his letter to the advertiser to appear a week after he was called out. He didn't.
Ed ignored everyone because he knew better than everyone else. As soon as it was going to pose a public embarrassment for the applicant, he recanted. HE posted his comments before the gaming commission with great pride while he stood in front of a map that showed what he was saying was patently false.
He apologized for overstating his opinion, but he never once defended a board member who was being publicly demonized for her opinion by him in secret. Now everyone knows and he is looking for absolution.
That blog never posted one opinion contrary to those of Langley. Not one. There was zero objectivity. People have been saying Ed was behind the blog for weeks and he said nothing. It was on the news, nothing, approached by people at the county, nothing and outed in the advertiser and still nothing. No response letter in this week's letter to the claim. I am of the opinion that only the applicant who may suffer an embarrassment from his actions could influence him. Remember, the applicant had private, individual meetings with the board early on and has been accused of guiding this process. Why would they stop now?
No, Ed can't prove it's not him because he is in fact the administrator of that blog. As a result, that blog is part of the administration which supports the application. This is a serious PR problem and they are being "lobbied" to tone it down.
If any respectable person was accused and innocent, they would go to any length to prove they were not responsible and expose the perpetrator for making them look bad. Ed can't do that and they know it. Furthermore, if it really wasn't him, they would be far more supportive of Maryann Matters and ensure that she remains a part of their majority for the rest of the important business in town and the accomplishments they claim they are responsible for.
The applicant deserves credit, if in fact it was them, for being able to reason with an individual, who completely disregarded the public and harassed them for simply having an opinion. Again, shame on them all.
12:20-interesting but difficult to believe the casino intervened and here is why. Ed has a history of the same childish behavior via blog rantings. That blog was taken down when Ed started to feel heat from some private pressures within. In my very humble opinion, it was political pressure from within that caused him to take it down.
ReplyDeleteWhatever the reason, does it matter (excuse the pun). It is down. Everyone knows who the man behind that blog's curtain was so does it really matter as long as the blog and the pitiful, juvenile comments it spawned are gone? Not really. It's gone, he won't apologize to anyone he tore apart but he has made himself an albatross around Keith's neck, which Keith can ill afford.
Internet 101 teaches that it's never really gone in cyberspace. It will come back to haunt them time and time again.
DeleteWait and see how things change AFTER the casino license is awarded. Whether it's awarded to EG or another applicant, it will be the campaign battle of the century for the Supervisor's seat. Suddenly, the SWF crew won't find MAM so despicable anymore. The question is, how will she find them?
ReplyDeleteTo 11:56, 10:51 and 12:20---At least some of us knew when we were being stalked and followed because they reported it on their blog. They stalked some of us and then reported it. I wonder if the stalking stops since the blog is down. I wonder if we can open our window curtains now.
ReplyDeleteAnn, I would continue to be careful if I were you. The attacks on you were a bit more threatening than the other posts. At least one of those guys has some evil creepy obsession with you. The fact that they so easily slipped into stalking is alarming to me and should be to you. Obsession and stalking are gateway behaviors. Put some mace, a camera, and a tape recorder in your handbag.
DeleteEd:
ReplyDeleteResign - both the Ethics Board position and as deputy "stupidvisor". Sorry, super nasty, I know. I could not resist. But how does it feel to be on the receiving end of what you posted on your own blog? Hmm?
Your credibility is LONG gone and never to return. You have acted like a jerk. That's the simple reality. You own that and the resulting consequences.
Your political career, such as it was, has gone down the tubes with your absolutely stupid blogs, your public rants, your poorly constructed and more poorly researched writings, and your slavish devotion to a failed politician - Langley.
Go away, please. Now. And forever. You and Langley are deeply and seriously yesterday's news.
Has anyone sent Ed Gilbert's letter on the Matterss blog to the siting commission? It would be nice if Ed would send it to the commission with an apology but is there any evidence that he has done so?
ReplyDeleteRemember that Ed was speaking to the Commission when he stated facts contrary to the facts in evidence. Some of what he said was about the residents he is paid to represent but some of it was about the site. He gave misrepresentations to the siting commission about the site and now he admits it. I think the Commission should know.
I sent his T.U. blog that called us NIMBYS and said we were a small group who lived on the streets nearest to the casino. I also included Mike Huberts response in shutting it down. I also sent Morgan Hooks rants during the public comment session, all to give an example of how our "leaders and developers have treated us.
Delete@ 3:26 PM-
ReplyDeleteYou are right. If Ed had any Ethics, he would send his letter to the siting Commission himself.
12:59pm, i do not believe Feathers reads the blogs or can be bothered with doing so; however, he is the only one who suffers from controversy over this issue. I have every confidence that when Rita read the advertiser article, Keith likely got balled out and told to get his pitt bull under control. So I guess everyone is right. This isn't about Ed, it's about getting a casino and toning down the rhetoric is important to make it appear to the gaming commission as if the public supports it. It's a little late for that though.
ReplyDeleteI left the Board meeting early on Wednesday, before the fun began I guess. But I did hear a report that the Supervisor denied that the administration and the casino developers had conspired to avoid the requirements of the Open Meetings Law. I would direct him to the primary documents which I got from the Town which contradict his assertion. The FOIL'ed material indicates clearly that the question of whether Feathers should meet with the Board members individually or as a group was discussed and that the Town Attorney was apparently consulted on the matter.
ReplyDeleteThe whole agenda of Feathers and Company was to keep as much as possible from the people who pay the freight in this Town. And Mr. Langley participated fully in that agenda.
it's said that one can't always remember a lie but one never forgets the truth
DeleteGadfly 5:51 PM,
ReplyDeleteSadly,this was just the latest example of Supervisor Langley's duplicitous assertions before a roomful of his constituents. He must think nobody is listening at Town Board meetings.
Mr. Langley, just because you don't listen to your constituents doesn't mean we don't listen closely to you.
We've been listening carefully since you tried to secretly sneak the casino past us and we won't be going away any time soon.
NO LANGLEY in 2015.
Yes, Gadfly, you definitely left too soon. Langley dropped his guard and allowed something of a free exchange of conversation between himself and the great unwashed in the hull of the ship. Residents then took the opportunity to express their thoughts over his comments when he said "It's great that we're finally talking about something else besides casino." Well, it was almost as if Langley had a bullseye on his forehead as people took aim at his stupid and accusatory comment. The man has no common sense whatsoever and no ability to connect with the people. Even Tom was irritated by Langley's comments when Tom can usually find the humor in any situation. NO LANGLEY 2015.
ReplyDeleteLangley's flippant (look it up Chris) and stunningly insensitive comment about the casino really struck a raw nerve with the dedicated people who have sacrificed much and tirelessly worked to keep a casino out of East Greenbush. Even those few casino advocates present seemed shocked by Langley's remarks.
ReplyDeleteI agree with 6:29 and 7:25, NO LANGLEY 2015. Let's get some lawn signs and brochures printed. I'm in.
Ed's blog says they are "starting over" and yet they haven't posted one comment that has been submitted, and I've submitted several. Perhaps Ed can't figure out how to write a post that isn't nasty, is objective without hurting his boss or one that won't elicit a flurry of comments that would be critical of him and the administration that he won't post. Just an FYI Ed, it's way easier to simply take it down and forget it than to try and perpetrate this elaborate rouse on residents like it's not you. It IS you, it's not us SAYING we know it, it's already been traced to you and it will in fact haunt Keith if he runs. Just try to figure out a way to fix the town without locating a casino in a location that will alter the entire fabric of town forever. How about that Ed? If you'd like I can send a cartoon rendering of what I mean so you can understand it!
ReplyDeleteI've been attending TB meetings on a regular basis since the Langley casino sell out became public. Based on Langley's behavior at those meetings, I just can't wait until the next election (2015) cycle, particularly the candidates debates.
ReplyDeleteCan you imagine how Langley will act during a debate, having to answer specific questions (with follow up) from a knowledgeable panel (think Ken Crowe of the TU, Danielle Sanzone from The Record and Dan Levy from Channel 13), as well as questions submitted from the audience?
Here's a question for you, in the light of the ZBA action last week in which they deemed the "amenities" of a casino to enjoy the same immunity from local zoning that "gaming" does in that Thompson Hill PDD......What if Feathers decides that a strip club like DeCarlos - now owned by one of his partners on Thompson Hill - should be an "amenity" at Capital View? Didn't appear that the ZBA had really thought this matter through. (Read due diligence.) Seems that our administrative types just can't grapple with the concept of unintended consequences when it comes to "bending" what the law says. I think they opened a can of worms.
ReplyDeleteMr. ZBA Chairman.....You said that the ZBA did "what the Town wanted, plain and simple." Are you sure? Did any of you think the possible consequences through?
DeleteThe acting ZBA chairman for the casino issue is Phil Malone's guy. How would you expect him to act and decide. Business as usual.
DeleteGadfly, that is an outstanding point! The zoning board apparently did NOT, in their decision, define or identify the nature of the amenities, only that any amenities that the casino would include would enjoy the exemption. Along those lines, if, subsequent to the zoning board's ruling, the planning board can discriminate which amenities are allowable, does that negate the ruling or have they forfeited the right to restrict any given use? There is an adult zone down along 9J for those kinds of establishments, so it is an allowable use in the town, relegated to a specific zone. The zoning board in essence has just said that it doesn't matter. If it's with the casino, it's exempt. Great point and also, very scary! They have rendered zoning useless.
ReplyDeleteWill Keith Langley be writing about the potential of a "strip club" on Thompson Hill in his next Supervisor's Report?
ReplyDeleteIf so, will Mr. Langley give us more than "it is what it is" as an explanation this time?
I so hope we're NOT awarded the casino license. If people are this upset now, I don't even want to think about how upset we'll be if no one except one zoning board member and one town board member had the personal integrity to acknowledge the truth about this parasitic industry and vote no to this casino fiasco. How could so many public officials have such callus disregard for an entire suburban town of 16,500 people? It makes me think the deck's been stacked and the board members bought since long before April but the culture of secrecy within the Langley administration has prevailed because he's so insistent on it. It was Councilperson Matters who outed the culture of secrecy with this supervisor, and , as a taxpayer, I'm really grateful to her for having the courage to say it. It's nothing but insulting and alarming to be excluded from the governing process. We need open, transparent government officials but I now know that that's not going to happen as long as Keith Langley is Supervisor.
ReplyDeleteIt is abundantly clear from the FOILed notes from the meetings between Town officials/staff and the casino developers that secrecy and the exclusion of the public were central concerns. This is profoundly offensive. This is the most important issue to EVER face the citizens of this Town. And what we got was a song and dance about "leadership" doing what was in our best interest. Did anybody ask you thought was in your best interest? Not a chance. A bunch of paternalistic and imperialistic mumbo-jumbo from a collection of special interests. Never again!!!
DeleteI read Dwight Jenkins' insightful run down of the action in our town last week. I would like to recommend it to Gadfly readers (East Greenbush Dreams on Wordpress). While I eagerly await Dwight's next installment, I was reminded of something that really bothered me at the beginning of the TB meeting. It was Keith Langley reading the letter from Chief Lavin thanking Langley and the town employees for fixing up the work space. While I recognize the value of complimenting the employees who do good work, doing it in this manner is a way for Langley to attempt to pump himself and his DPW appointments up at the beginning of what promises to be a year long election season 2015. I am guessing that the police chief was asked master the fine art of composing this letter while holding his nose. His motivation for puffing Langley up in this way? Langley is the negotiator in the unresolved union talks and Lavin's men are working without a contract.
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me that all town employees (police included) are entitled to a well kept workplace (like the space described by the Chief) and meaningful work (like the work recently completed by DPW in the police department).
It is sad to see Langley groveling like this but one ironic note is that we finally saw something transparent from Langley.
NO LANGLEY IN 2015!
The word around town is that the audits (plural) cannot be completed because there is, literally, no bookkeeping for the last couple of years of the McCabe administration and the first year of the Langley administration.
ReplyDeleteDoes everyone fully grasp what exactly that means? Seriously, this is the equivalent of a fiscal complete meltdown. It really and truly is exactly that - no exaggeration.
Why not assign re-constructing the town's books to the CFAC? Why not do the same thing with a team of volunteers from the town's citizens?
There has to be bank records, checking accounts, deposits, etc., etc.
Better yet...why doesn't Supervisor Langley contact the OSC and absolutely insist on a full, complete forensic audit?
This is no joke and not a political comment.
CP Mangold has been pushing to have Toski and Wojeski meet with the Town Board at a Pre-Board Meeting for some time now.
DeleteAs I recall from the 10/9/14 Pre-Board Meeting, Supervisor Langley directed Comptroller Phillips to set up a meeting with Toski, Wojeski and a consultant the Town hired to address the audits and see what could now be done to salvage the effort. When a date was selected, the Supervisor would schedule a Special TB Meeting.
Then, on 10/15/14, CFAC recommended against "a reconciliation of or completion of previously attempted external audits."
Will the Special Meeting with Toski, Wojeski and the Town's consultant happen or be scuttled?
Pete Stenson
Be sure to read Dwight Jenkins at the following links:
ReplyDeletehttp://eastgreenbushdreams.wordpress.com/2014/10/18/the-week-that-was-and-wasnt/
http://eastgreenbushdreams.wordpress.com/2014/10/19/more-of-the-week-that-was-and-wasnt-audits/
Is this two-faced duplicity or what? This is what Phil Malone says about a pipeline traversing Columbia County.....
ReplyDelete"He said that he was not aware of Kinder Morgan’s proposed pipeline that would traverse northern Columbia County, but said he would oppose it if local towns and residents objected to the plan and would not endorse the use of eminent domain if it has no advantage for the community.
“It’s their community, so I think they should have a say in it,” he said."
They get their say about a pipeline. But he's a part of the political cartel forcing a casino on East Greenbush. What a hypocrite.
DJ, You are no different, praising Sue Mangold at the TB meeting after her outspoken support for the casino. Only silenced when she was caught enhancing her family wealth with her vote.
DeleteI support Sue's questions on the financials. She was wrong on the casino, and I think she knows it. I'm encouraged that she is trying to do the right thing on some other issues. I think that some Dems have figured out that reform is in their future if they are to have a future. Same is true of the Reps. There will be no Rep candidates of quality coming forward as long as DeFruscio is Chairman. I think this is a year for a third party initiative. Or certified reformers in either major camp.
DeleteDJ, How can you possibly trust one word that comes out of Sue Mangold's mouth, based on her voting record along. One can only imagine how much money she has made for her family, between her time spent on the planning board, now the Town Board.
DeleteWhat I don't trust is the "get out of jail free" cards that the CFAC is passing out to four years worth of financial management around here. We need third party review according to accepted standard of what has been going on. I think Sue supports that.
DeleteMalone is a hypocrite!! He is trying to get votes from Columbia county residents and willing to say anything to get their votes. Those people should know he voted in favor of the casino against the majority of people. How could an environmentalist be in favor of a casino when it is destroying open space? Ridiculous.
DeleteWhat's the title of this Post?.....Cognitive Dissonance. Our politicians talk out of both sides of their mouths and don't recognize any contradictions. That's cognitive dissonance or ignorance or perversity.
DeletePhil Malone was reported in the Times Union to have $8K in his campaign account this year in his bid for an Assembly seat. Now where would Phil Malone get $8K? Could it be from one James Featherstonehaugh?
ReplyDeleteSue Mangold is not to be trusted, Gadfly. If she cares so much about the town's finances, then why wasn't she working in the town's best interest four years ago when she was first elected. We never heard a peep out of her until the Repubs took the majority in January. Now she's just full of questions but it's nothing but a subterfuge to help the Dems take back control next year. The fact that she voted yes for the casino twice when she knew she shouldn't further proves that she can't be trusted. She's all about the Harts, screw the town. She became indignant with a resident who criticized her at a board meeting but she's as slick and slimy as McCabe, Malone, O'Brien, and all the Dems who worked as "the majority" for 14 years while this town sunk deeper and deeper into the financial quicksand. It was so bad that the likes of Keith Langley slipped in under the radar in an 'anyone but Rick McCabe' campaign that proved successful but, casino or not, don't think anyone has forgotten how we got here. We haven't.
ReplyDeleteI am by no means defending Sue Mangold, but her recusal wasn't all that surprising. What I find more disturbing is the amount of town officials on all of the boards that had to recuse themselves, and that's just those that were "honest". We all make mistakes, Sue may have moved on from them amd may truly be trying to bring change now. Let's not lose focus at the man who is responsible for it all, Langley.
ReplyDelete7:39 p.m. Yes, we all make mistakes but not usually the same mistake twice. Sue Mangold is a smart and savvy Hart business woman who knew exactly what she was doing when she voted for the casino and hoped she would get away with it. She didn't. But let's suppose for a moment that she truly didn't know that she should have recused herself from the casino vote. As a voting member of the town board, it's her responsibility to know the Ethics Laws and to take the initiative to find out when she claims she doesn't know something relative to a conflict of interest with her voting. She also used the word "unknown" as an answer on her financial disclosure form. This is unacceptable for a public official. You never write "unknown," you put the form aside and go find out, then you return to the form when you can put down accurate information to the best of your ability. At one time, Sue Mangold stated that she would resign from the town board if she had to complete a financial disclosure form. I don't know about you but that tells me all I need to know about Ms. Sue "I Don't Know" Mangold. And, lastly, as for Mr. Langley, he sat there and said nothing while CP Mangold was voting for his casino. If anyone thinks that he didn't know she shouldn't be voting, I have some swamp land in the Florida Everglades to sell you real cheap.
ReplyDeleteDon't miss Ken Crowe's article on the front page of the Capital Region section in today's TU on Save East Greenbush:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Their-goal-No-casino-in-town-5833589.php
I read Mr. Crowe's article. I didn't realize that Save East Greenbush is such a highly organized and powerful group. The state should know that if they choose EG for the license, SEG won't go away. No one will be comfortable gambling in EG with protesters waving NO CASINO signs and yelling 'Get out of here!' at the foot of the casino driveway. Oh, what a mess you made for EG, Mr. Cuomo, Mr. Feathers, and Mr. Langley.
ReplyDeleteHopefully this group will stay together and keep paying attention for next year's Town elections.
DeleteNO LANGLEY in 2015.
The entire Town Board is responsible for this casino mess we are in, They all voted not once, but twice unanimously in support of this nightmare. Every single one of them, NO FREE PASSES FOR THEM AND NO CASINO FOR EAST GREENBUSH.
ReplyDeleteFor the record this was also posted on talks blog. Let's see what they stand for. NO FREE PASSES AND NO CASINO IN EAST GREENBUSH.
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